Are the changes in the Arctic messing with our weather? Analysis

By: Dr. Ricky Rood , 9:20 PM GMT on January 26, 2014

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Are the changes in the Arctic messing with our weather? Analysis

In the last blog, I promised an analysis of why I conclude that what is happening in the Arctic makes it to my list of the big-ticket items of the past year.

I want to start with the work of Jennifer Francis and her collaborators. Professor Francis gave an excellent seminar in my department last week, which can be viewed here. This seminar uses as a foundation the paper Francis and Vavrus (2012), Evidence linking Arctic amplification to extreme weather in mid-latitudes. There is a whole set of coherent and convergent evidence that documents the changes in the Arctic. There is an increase in temperature, which is much greater in the Arctic than at lower latitudes and in the tropics (Polar or Arctic amplification). This has led to large changes in Arctic sea ice and springtime snow cover. There has been a lengthening of the growing season and an increase in activity in the northern forests – the greening of the Arctic (200 blogs ago, Getting Ready for Spring 5).

In the past, roughly, 15 years, there has been an observed change in the of the Arctic sea-level atmospheric pressure (see previous blog). The pressure is slightly higher, which leads to a weakening of the stream of air that flows around the North Pole. I wrote a tutorial about this in Wobbles in the Barrier. Also in the past decade there have been a number of researchers, for example, Liu et al. (2012) who in Impact of declining Arctic sea ice on winter snowfall – noted circulation patterns that have “ … some resemblance to the negative phase of the winter Arctic oscillation. However, the atmospheric circulation change linked to the reduction of sea ice shows much broader meridional meanders in midlatitudes and clearly different interannual variability than the classical Arctic oscillation.”

These papers lead to a few questions. Are the changes in the Arctic sea-level pressure a direct consequence of local changes in the Arctic, or are they more closely related to changes in global circulation patterns? Are changes in the Arctic sea-level pressure causing changes in weather in the middle latitudes? Are the differences we have seen in the past 15 years indicative of a climate-change related differences in weather patterns? Is what we have traditionally called the Arctic Oscillation changing?

Trenberth and Fasullo are following the heat of the warming earth, with the primary goal of understanding of how much heat is contributing to warming the Earth’s surface air temperature versus how much is going to heating the ocean and melting ice and snow. Their focus is on approximately the past 15 years. Therefore, they pay attention to known ways that the atmosphere and ocean vary (Some previous tutorials: Still Following the Heat and Ocean, Atmosphere, Ice and Land). Trenberth and Fasullo document the strong influence of the 1997-1998 El Nino. El Nino typically has a large effect on global temperature. The 1997-1998 El Nino was especially large. Trenberth and Fasullo show that the temperature in the atmosphere and oceans still remembers the 1997-1998 El Nino. They also examine the Pacific Decadal Oscillation, which is characterized by sea surface temperature differences being above (or below) average in the north-central Pacific while they are below (or above) in the north and east Pacific near the Aleutian Islands and the Gulf of Alaska. The Pacific Decadal Oscillation has been in a pattern of being cooler than average in the north and east Pacific since the 1997-1998 El Nino. Trenberth and Fasullo document a pattern that spans the globe, and the changes in the Arctic are part of that pattern. Conversely, their analysis would suggest that the global aspects of circulation pattern are too large to be caused by changes in the Arctic – it just takes too much energy.

What might be a scientifically based difference between whether changes in the Arctic are part of a global pattern or caused by the loss of sea ice changing the absorption and reflection of solar energy is to some extent not relevant to the question about weather patterns over the U.S. My experience in scientific controversies of this nature is that there are usually both global and local pieces to the puzzle. Further, changes in the U.S. weather could be directly linked to changes in the Arctic as well as to global patterns. In both the Trenberth and Fasullo and the Francis and Vavrus (2012) analysis there are consequential changes in jet stream pattern which is strongly influential to weather in the U.S. and, in fact, all of the middle latitudes of the Northern Hemisphere.

It’s not surprising that changes in the polar jet stream, the river of air that meanders around the North Pole, would have a profound effect on weather in the U.S. The waves that make up the weather systems of winter storms, for example, draw their energy from the environment that forms the jet stream. The jet stream steers these storms. In classes on dynamical meteorology, students learn that what is going on at the jet stream is often better information for forecasting weather than what is going on at the surface. Though there is a direct link between the jet stream and weather systems, the path of cause and effect in the changes in the Arctic, changes in the jet stream and changes to extreme events in the U.S. is not easy to map.

We have seen observations from Francis and Vavrus and Liu et al. (2012) that suggest large meanders in the jet stream. Both of these papers suggest that the scale of these meanders is unprecedented and does not fit easily into the framework we have used historically to describe the Arctic Oscillation - the primary way we describe correlated variability between the Arctic and the middle latitudes. In addition to the Arctic Oscillation, another characteristic we use to describe mid-latitude weather is blocking. Blocking describes a pattern of atmospheric flow, perhaps a particular configuration of the jet stream. Blocking slows or stops the normal west-to-east movement of storms around the Earth. Here is a nice description of blocking. Blocking is most common with high pressure, and high pressure is associated with the northern meanders of the jet stream. Note, blocking is associated with the meanders in the jet stream, but large meanders do not always mean that our definition of “block” is fulfilled. Blocking patterns are difficult to predict on a case-by-case basis. Blocking patterns are known to be associated with droughts, floods, heat waves and cold snaps. Therefore, when we look to a way that changes in the jet stream might change the weather over the U.S. we logically look a changes in blocking, which will discussed more fully in next blog.

r

Cold Weather in Denver: Climate Change and Arctic Oscillation (8)

Climate Change and the Arctic Oscillation 2

Climate Change and the Arctic Oscillation 1

Wobbles in the Barriers

Barriers in the Atmosphere

Behavior

Definitions and Some Background

August Arctic Oscillation presentation

CPC Climate Glossary “The Arctic Oscillation is a pattern in which atmospheric pressure at polar and middle latitudes fluctuates between negative and positive phases.”





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and this is not helping temps any time soon.

Mount Sinabung paints Sumatra gray

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Code Red alert of blizzard, heavy snowfalls in six South-Eastern counties
Social | lavinia.serban | January 29th, 2014 at 9:00 PM


Closed roads, Sun Highway severely affected by weather conditions, and over 210 cancelled trains. Alert state, extended to four more counties: Calarasi, Constanta, Tulcea. Man dead due to the blizzard in Buzau.



There is a powerful storm in the Black Sea. (The Danube River port of) Tulcea will face most problems in terms of the weather,’ explained Florinela Georgescu. The ANM Managing Director Ion Sandu also underscored that issuing the codes is a very complicated matter and stressed the forecasters do not put codes in place only ‘for the sake of the press’. ‘Things are extremely complicated when codes are issued, we have not put a Code Red alert in place for the sake of the press. Wednesday afternoon will be very bad from the viewpoint of the weather. The specialists will establish in the coming hours if there are the conditions in place so as to issue a Code Red alert for several hours particularly for Braila, Constanta and Tulcea,’ the Forecaster said, as quoted by Agerpres.
All national roads were closed in Calarasi , Tulcea and Braila. In Ialomita, three national roads and fifteen county roads were closed yesterday, while in Buzau two national roads – DN 22 between Ramnicu Sarat and Braila and DN 2C between Buzau and Slobozia – were blocked again due to the blizzard, and traffic on two other national roads – DN 2 (E 85) and DN 2B between Buzau and Braila – was restricted and directed by traffic officers. In Braila, inhabitants from seven villages remained isolated due to snowfall, whereas in Galati, three localities faced the same situation.
A 42-years old man was found dead in the snow in Cernatesti village, Buzau. According to ’Jurnal de Buzau’ local paper, the man left home on January 27, heading to his aunt’s house but never returned. Alerted by his sister, police officers and locals began the search, but found him dead in the snow, only 150 meters far from his aunt’s house.
The Ministry of Defense has deployed over 240 military crews in Vrancea, Braila, Valcea, Buzau, and Galati counties to help clear the snow and over 200 households in Buzau, Vrancea, and Braila have been cleared so far. Gendarmes provided medicine, food, and blankets

Link


Frost death toll reaches 13
Social | anca.bernovici | February 2nd, 2014 at 9:00 PM

The lowest temperature of this winter was -23.6 degrees Celsius at Miercurea Ciuc.

After weeks of snow warning codes and blizzard, freezing descended upon Romania. Secretary of State with Ministry of Internal Affairs (MAI) Raed Arafat MD announced on Friday that the death toll caused by frost reached 13 between January 26 and 31, most of them elderly people who slipped on the pavement or homeless people. According to Arafat, among the casualties there were also people who drank alcohol prior to hypothermia. The thermometers dropped to almost -24 degrees Celsius in Miercurea Ciuc on Saturday morning, the lowest temperature recorded this year. The relentless freezing does not scare people anymore, who say they got used to long winters. The meteorologists expect temperatures to drop down to -30 degrees this winter in that area,. The lowest temperature of February in Harghita County was recorded in 1987 in Miercurea Ciuc, -35.2 degrees Celsius.
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If any of you are interested in restoring Northern Arctic Ice now I have a Facebook page called "Restore Northern Summertime Arctic Ice Now" up and running...

Just join and lets get this done...

Link

https://www.facebook.com/groups/783642181651058/
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
Quoting 886. yoboi:


they are always here....just post something about AGW being false.....


Whelp, I know what I'm posting on April 1.
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Another downtick the past few days... Thanks Polar Vortex....




Arrows denote Polar Vortex Downticks on 2013 - 2014 blue line.....
This should not happen in the middle of winter or at least not so often...


.




...







..
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
889. yoboi
Quoting 888. Daisyworld:
Summer Sea Levels Rising Fast Along Florida's Gulf Coast

Becky Oskin | LiveScience | January 30, 2014

Summer high tides are getting higher in the eastern Gulf of Mexico, boosting the destructive power of hurricanes, a new study finds.

The trend is strongest in Florida, such as in Key West, where tidal flooding regularly inundates low-lying city streets. Summer sea levels are now 1.8 inches (4.5 centimeters) higher than before 1993, and that's on top of the contribution from global sea level rise, according to the study, published Jan. 3 in the journal Geophysical Research Letters. On the flip side, winter tides are now lower, the study finds.

Put more simply, in the past two decades, summer sea level has increased on Florida's Gulf Coast by a total of 4 inches (10 cm). "Sea level is rising because of global warming, but on top of this, the seasonal cycle is also changing," said Thomas Wahl, lead study author and a coastal engineer at the University of South Florida in St. Petersburg. "We don't know whether this is climate change or part of a natural cycle, but this increase over the last 20 years is not found elsewhere in the world."

All coastlines undergo seasonal cycles in their tides. Summer tides are higher than winter tides because of several factors, such as the difference between summer and winter water temperatures; rainfall and seasonal changes in air temperature; and wind. (For example, cold water takes up less volume than warm water, so the tides in winter are lower.)

Wahl and his colleagues discovered the dramatic change by analyzing tide records collected since 1900 from 13 Gulf Coast cities, from the tip of Florida to the Texas coast. In the past century, many coastal Florida cities have undergone significant sea level rise — faster than the global trend. For instance, sea level rose 9 inches (22 cm) in Key West during the last 100 years. But until now, no one had closely looked at seasonal tidal cycles in the Gulf.

Watch out, Florida

Not all Gulf Coast cities saw the same extreme changes as Florida, the study reports. No significant results were found in the western Gulf of Mexico, including tide gauges in Texas and Louisiana. Only coastal cities east of Alabama showed a significant change in summer and winter sea level cycles since the 1990s.

Wahl and his co-authors think the summer tides are getting higher and winter tides are getting lower because summers and winters in the Gulf of Mexico are also becoming warmer and colder, respectively. "We found similar cycles in the air temperature and air pressure in the eastern part of the Gulf," Wahl said.

Though the tidal changes are small — just a few inches — the effect does increase the risk of storm-surge flooding from hurricanes and tropical storms, Wahl said. [Video: Storm Surge: The Deadliest Part of a Hurricane]

"If a hurricane hits the coastline and the base water level is already 5 to 10 centimeters [2 to 4 inches] higher than it was 20 years ago, this leads to a higher storm-surge water level," Wahl told Live Science.

The U.S. Geological Survey released a hurricane-induced coastal erosion map for the Gulf Coast and East Coast on Jan. 7, and predicts that 27 percent of Gulf beaches are at risk of flooding in a Category 1 hurricane.

"Hurricanes are not required for significant coastal change in the Gulf region," the report concluded. "Waves and storm surge associated with tropical storms and winter cold fronts provide sufficient energy to put low-elevation beaches and dunes at risk due to erosion."
Member Since: August 25, 2010 Posts: 7 Comments: 2348
Summer Sea Levels Rising Fast Along Florida's Gulf Coast

Becky Oskin | LiveScience | January 30, 2014

Summer high tides are getting higher in the eastern Gulf of Mexico, boosting the destructive power of hurricanes, a new study finds.

The trend is strongest in Florida, such as in Key West, where tidal flooding regularly inundates low-lying city streets. Summer sea levels are now 1.8 inches (4.5 centimeters) higher than before 1993, and that's on top of the contribution from global sea level rise, according to the study, published Jan. 3 in the journal Geophysical Research Letters. On the flip side, winter tides are now lower, the study finds.

Put more simply, in the past two decades, summer sea level has increased on Florida's Gulf Coast by a total of 4 inches (10 cm). "Sea level is rising because of global warming, but on top of this, the seasonal cycle is also changing," said Thomas Wahl, lead study author and a coastal engineer at the University of South Florida in St. Petersburg. "We don't know whether this is climate change or part of a natural cycle, but this increase over the last 20 years is not found elsewhere in the world."

All coastlines undergo seasonal cycles in their tides. Summer tides are higher than winter tides because of several factors, such as the difference between summer and winter water temperatures; rainfall and seasonal changes in air temperature; and wind. (For example, cold water takes up less volume than warm water, so the tides in winter are lower.)

Wahl and his colleagues discovered the dramatic change by analyzing tide records collected since 1900 from 13 Gulf Coast cities, from the tip of Florida to the Texas coast. In the past century, many coastal Florida cities have undergone significant sea level rise — faster than the global trend. For instance, sea level rose 9 inches (22 cm) in Key West during the last 100 years. But until now, no one had closely looked at seasonal tidal cycles in the Gulf.

Watch out, Florida

Not all Gulf Coast cities saw the same extreme changes as Florida, the study reports. No significant results were found in the western Gulf of Mexico, including tide gauges in Texas and Louisiana. Only coastal cities east of Alabama showed a significant change in summer and winter sea level cycles since the 1990s.

Wahl and his co-authors think the summer tides are getting higher and winter tides are getting lower because summers and winters in the Gulf of Mexico are also becoming warmer and colder, respectively. "We found similar cycles in the air temperature and air pressure in the eastern part of the Gulf," Wahl said.

Though the tidal changes are small — just a few inches — the effect does increase the risk of storm-surge flooding from hurricanes and tropical storms, Wahl said. [Video: Storm Surge: The Deadliest Part of a Hurricane]

"If a hurricane hits the coastline and the base water level is already 5 to 10 centimeters [2 to 4 inches] higher than it was 20 years ago, this leads to a higher storm-surge water level," Wahl told Live Science.

The U.S. Geological Survey released a hurricane-induced coastal erosion map for the Gulf Coast and East Coast on Jan. 7, and predicts that 27 percent of Gulf beaches are at risk of flooding in a Category 1 hurricane.

"Hurricanes are not required for significant coastal change in the Gulf region," the report concluded. "Waves and storm surge associated with tropical storms and winter cold fronts provide sufficient energy to put low-elevation beaches and dunes at risk due to erosion."
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887. yoboi
Quoting 886. yoboi:


they are always here....just post something about AGW being false.....



I still think they have an app to this blog....soon as someone says AGW being false...presto defcon 5 alert and here to save the day.....
Member Since: August 25, 2010 Posts: 7 Comments: 2348
886. yoboi
Quoting 885. PedleyCA:
What time does the night shift show up?


they are always here....just post something about AGW being false.....
Member Since: August 25, 2010 Posts: 7 Comments: 2348
What time does the night shift show up?
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I think I heard a pin drop, maybe it was a penny.
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Quoting 881. Birthmark:

What if we threw pennies into a tunnel. Whoa!


Energy would still be conserved...
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
"The unknown future rolls toward us"

A wunderblog
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Quoting 879. yoboi:


Do not worry...It looks like pennies will solve the problem......

What if we threw pennies into a tunnel. Whoa!
Member Since: October 30, 2005 Posts: 7 Comments: 5469
Quoting 878. Neapolitan:
Two articles that illustrate the growing dichotomy between ideological fantasy and scientific reality:


FANTASY

Misinformation Is Winning – Doubt In Climate Change Climbing

Climate change-related disasters have been rising for decades; yearly temperatures are rising in a nearly consistent pattern; extreme weather events are costing economies across the globe hundreds of billions of dollars. Despite the mounting evidence that climate change is both real and a major threat to our security, more people are buying into the idea that climate change is a myth.

A new poll from Yale University and George Mason shows that the percentage of Americans who don’t believe in climate change rose 7% in 2013 to 23% of the entire population. While 63% of the general public believes that climate change is occurring, only 47% believe that human activities are to blame. The poll also revealed that less than 50% of Americans believe that climate change will affect their lives, but 65% say that it could harm future generations.

---

All of the evidence points to the fact that climate change is real and that human beings are making it worse. Scientists agree that it is happening, and the physical evidence is all around us, so the big question is: why is the number of climate change deniers increasing?

The answer is that the misinformation machine has kicked into high gear, and 2013 saw a massive increase in the amount of climate change denial being given a microphone throughout various forms of media.

---

As extreme weather events increase and global temperatures continue to rise, so will the attacks on climate science.

The problem is not necessarily the denial industry, but a public that is so unwilling to accept the truth that they will buy into any piece of "good" news, even if all evidence points to the contrary.


---------------------------

REALITY

Human cause of global warming is near certainty, UN reports

Global warming is unequivocal, human influence has been the dominant cause since the mid-20th century, and atmospheric concentrations of greenhouse gases, already at levels not seen in at least 800,000 years, will persist for many centuries, the final version of the latest United Nations report on climate change warned today.

---

"Human influence has been detected in warming of the atmosphere and the ocean, in changes in the global water cycle, in reductions in snow and ice, in global mean sea level rise, and in changes in some climate extremes. This evidence for human influence has grown since AR4. It is extremely likely that human influence has been the dominant cause of the observed warming since the mid-20th century," the report stresses.

"Concentrations of CO2, CH4, and N2O now substantially exceed the highest concentrations recorded in ice cores during the past 800,000 years. The mean rates of increase in atmospheric concentrations over the past century are, with very high confidence, unprecedented in the last 22,000 years."

It notes that each of the last three decades has been successively warmer at the Earth's surface than any preceding decade since 1850, changes in many extreme weather and climate events have been observed since about 1950, the frequency of heat waves has likely increased in large parts of Europe, Asia and Australia.


They miss stated the title....... It should read "Beyond Certainty".
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
879. yoboi
Quoting 878. Neapolitan:
Two articles that illustrate the growing dichotomy between ideological fantasy and scientific reality:


FANTASY

Misinformation Is Winning – Doubt In Climate Change Climbing

Climate change-related disasters have been rising for decades; yearly temperatures are rising in a nearly consistent pattern; extreme weather events are costing economies across the globe hundreds of billions of dollars. Despite the mounting evidence that climate change is both real and a major threat to our security, more people are buying into the idea that climate change is a myth.

A new poll from Yale University and George Mason shows that the percentage of Americans who don’t believe in climate change rose 7% in 2013 to 23% of the entire population. While 63% of the general public believes that climate change is occurring, only 47% believe that human activities are to blame. The poll also revealed that less than 50% of Americans believe that climate change will affect their lives, but 65% say that it could harm future generations.

---

All of the evidence points to the fact that climate change is real and that human beings are making it worse. Scientists agree that it is happening, and the physical evidence is all around us, so the big question is: why is the number of climate change deniers increasing?

The answer is that the misinformation machine has kicked into high gear, and 2013 saw a massive increase in the amount of climate change denial being given a microphone throughout various forms of media.

---

As extreme weather events increase and global temperatures continue to rise, so will the attacks on climate science.

The problem is not necessarily the denial industry, but a public that is so unwilling to accept the truth that they will buy into any piece of "good" news, even if all evidence points to the contrary.


---------------------------

REALITY

Human cause of global warming is near certainty, UN reports

Global warming is unequivocal, human influence has been the dominant cause since the mid-20th century, and atmospheric concentrations of greenhouse gases, already at levels not seen in at least 800,000 years, will persist for many centuries, the final version of the latest United Nations report on climate change warned today.

---

"Human influence has been detected in warming of the atmosphere and the ocean, in changes in the global water cycle, in reductions in snow and ice, in global mean sea level rise, and in changes in some climate extremes. This evidence for human influence has grown since AR4. It is extremely likely that human influence has been the dominant cause of the observed warming since the mid-20th century," the report stresses.

"Concentrations of CO2, CH4, and N2O now substantially exceed the highest concentrations recorded in ice cores during the past 800,000 years. The mean rates of increase in atmospheric concentrations over the past century are, with very high confidence, unprecedented in the last 22,000 years."

It notes that each of the last three decades has been successively warmer at the Earth's surface than any preceding decade since 1850, changes in many extreme weather and climate events have been observed since about 1950, the frequency of heat waves has likely increased in large parts of Europe, Asia and Australia.


Do not worry...It looks like pennies will solve the problem......
Member Since: August 25, 2010 Posts: 7 Comments: 2348
Two articles that illustrate the growing dichotomy between ideological fantasy and scientific reality:


FANTASY

Misinformation Is Winning – Doubt In Climate Change Climbing

Climate change-related disasters have been rising for decades; yearly temperatures are rising in a nearly consistent pattern; extreme weather events are costing economies across the globe hundreds of billions of dollars. Despite the mounting evidence that climate change is both real and a major threat to our security, more people are buying into the idea that climate change is a myth.

A new poll from Yale University and George Mason shows that the percentage of Americans who don’t believe in climate change rose 7% in 2013 to 23% of the entire population. While 63% of the general public believes that climate change is occurring, only 47% believe that human activities are to blame. The poll also revealed that less than 50% of Americans believe that climate change will affect their lives, but 65% say that it could harm future generations.

---

All of the evidence points to the fact that climate change is real and that human beings are making it worse. Scientists agree that it is happening, and the physical evidence is all around us, so the big question is: why is the number of climate change deniers increasing?

The answer is that the misinformation machine has kicked into high gear, and 2013 saw a massive increase in the amount of climate change denial being given a microphone throughout various forms of media.

---

As extreme weather events increase and global temperatures continue to rise, so will the attacks on climate science.

The problem is not necessarily the denial industry, but a public that is so unwilling to accept the truth that they will buy into any piece of "good" news, even if all evidence points to the contrary.


---------------------------

REALITY

Human cause of global warming is near certainty, UN reports

Global warming is unequivocal, human influence has been the dominant cause since the mid-20th century, and atmospheric concentrations of greenhouse gases, already at levels not seen in at least 800,000 years, will persist for many centuries, the final version of the latest United Nations report on climate change warned today.

---

"Human influence has been detected in warming of the atmosphere and the ocean, in changes in the global water cycle, in reductions in snow and ice, in global mean sea level rise, and in changes in some climate extremes. This evidence for human influence has grown since AR4. It is extremely likely that human influence has been the dominant cause of the observed warming since the mid-20th century," the report stresses.

"Concentrations of CO2, CH4, and N2O now substantially exceed the highest concentrations recorded in ice cores during the past 800,000 years. The mean rates of increase in atmospheric concentrations over the past century are, with very high confidence, unprecedented in the last 22,000 years."

It notes that each of the last three decades has been successively warmer at the Earth's surface than any preceding decade since 1850, changes in many extreme weather and climate events have been observed since about 1950, the frequency of heat waves has likely increased in large parts of Europe, Asia and Australia.
Member Since: November 8, 2009 Posts: 4 Comments: 13571
Never in my wildest dreams did I expect to see .6 Milliamps... I was expecting to see .005 or maybe .010 milliamps... But .6 on the 2 milliamp scale is actually 1.2 amps per penny which would mean 18 amps for the 15,000 pennies reduced to 120V ac...
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
Quoting 872. Kethern:


Let me point out an error or two.

The first is that energy sources in series add their voltages but not their currents, the current will be the same across all of them. Conversely assembled in parallel, the currents add but the voltage remains equal.

So using your figures, 150 pennies gets you 120 volts at .6 ma. To get to 9 amps you would need to tie together 15,000 of theses assemblies or 2,250,000 pennies. Not accounting for any system losses.

The other issue would be that the penny is not going to be an infinite source of energy so you need to determine the electrical capacity of the penny in milliamp-hours to determine how often they would need to be replaced.


Nope I get 15,000 pennies to get me required volts and amps if wired in series....If I transform the 12,000 volts down from the 15,000 pennies by a factor of 10 then the amps go up by a factor of ten also thus giving me 9 amps at 120V ac.... The 15,000 pennies have a lot of current once the voltage is reduced....Assuming no line losses...
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
I'm not sure how or when the numbers in that "Recent Recods Totals" table are compiled, because they appear to be in slight disagreement with the results of the following actual queries:

Low minimum: http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/extremes/records/monthly /mint/2014/01/00?sts[]=US#records_look_up

High maximum: http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/extremes/records/monthly /maxt/2014/01/00?sts[]=US#records_look_up

I mean, obviously 44 high maximum records is in agreement. But the table shows no YTD low minimums, where the actual lookup shows six.

Lemme check...
Member Since: November 8, 2009 Posts: 4 Comments: 13571
874. etxwx
Quoting 870. Physicistretired:
Allowing farmland to be temporarily flooded during extreme weather events would seem (at least to me) to be a far better long-term solution.



Perhaps, but keep in mind that flood waters may also contain contaminates and that needs to be taken into account. Such as discussed here: Predicting contamination of farmland after flooding
Member Since: Posts: Comments:
Quoting 871. Neapolitan:
Now that the final January numbers are in (though there may be a few stragglers), here's the month's tally for the U.S.:

heat

(Source: NOAA/NCDC)

I wonder what would have happened had we not had the two large outbreaks of Arctic air...

Maybe we are putting in different parameters but when I do year-to-date, I get:

Daily Records:
Year to Date Jan 1 - Feb 1, 2014
Rec High...818 552 Rec Low...2,235 1,054

Monthly Records:
Year to Date Jan 1 - Feb 1, 2014
Rec High...44 19 Rec Low...31 0

All-Time Records:
Year to Date Jan 1 - Feb 1, 2014
Rec High...0 0 Rec Low...10 0
Member Since: September 28, 2002 Posts: 5 Comments: 3210
Quoting 847. cyclonebuster:


I get 1500 penny batteries ( $15.00 ) gets me 120 volts and .9 amps for a year 24/7/365 continuous output...

I got .8 volts from it with .6 miliamps.... I figure if I wire 150 them in series I can get 120 volts DC with 90 miliamps.... I can then get a DC to AC converter and get some AC power from it.... If I scale it up to 1,500 pennies I can get 120Vac with it and .9 amps....If I scale it up again to 15,000 pennies with 120V ac I can get 9 amps from it..... Of course there would be some line losses but that is pretty significant if you run it 24/7/365.... It was very easy to do...


Let me point out an error or two.

The first is that energy sources in series add their voltages but not their currents, the current will be the same across all of them. Conversely assembled in parallel, the currents add but the voltage remains equal.

So using your figures, 150 pennies gets you 120 volts at .6 ma. To get to 9 amps you would need to tie together 15,000 of theses assemblies or 2,250,000 pennies. Not accounting for any system losses.

The other issue would be that the penny is not going to be an infinite source of energy so you need to determine the electrical capacity of the penny in milliamp-hours to determine how often they would need to be replaced.
Member Since: Posts: Comments:
Now that the final January numbers are in (though there may be a few stragglers), here's the month's tally for the U.S.:

heat

(Source: NOAA/NCDC)

I wonder what would have happened had we not had the two large outbreaks of Arctic air...

* - Monthly low minimum temperature records are set when any particular reporting station experiences the lowest reading it's ever measured during that particular month. Monthly high maximum temperature records are set when any particular reporting station experiences the highest reading it's ever measured during that particular month.
Member Since: November 8, 2009 Posts: 4 Comments: 13571
Quoting 869. barbamz:


Think so, yes, although I only know bits of information about the situation in the UK.

Nevertheless, here's a fresh article about these issues:

Flooding: five lessons we have learned
What our washed-out winter has taught us
Damian Carrington, The Observer, Sunday 2 February 2014

Main points in this article:
- Concrete is no longer a solution
- Soft flood defences mean hard choices
- Flood protection often works
- Cutting flood defence spending is a false economy
- Climate change appears to be hitting harder and faster than feared


Excellent article, Barb. The embedded links made for fascinating reading.

Choosing between crops and flood management is a tough call. The UK is addressing this already. I can't imagine a similar response in the US.

Hurricane Sandy is an excellent case in point. I live near a river that has seen horrific flooding at least 4 times in the last ~10 years. Sandy was the most recent flooding event there.

Many homeowners along that river have spent the last 15 months putting their houses up on stilts. Allowing farmland to be temporarily flooded during extreme weather events would seem (at least to me) to be a far better long-term solution.

We can't fight nature forever.
Member Since: December 21, 2013 Posts: 0 Comments: 231
Quoting 748. Physicistretired:


If I understand what I saw and read there, Barb, the UK is witnessing a battle between old-school 'environmental' groups, working to 'protect' natural settings via reduced dredging, and the new realities of climate change/extreme weather/much-needed-mitigation.

I'm unfamiliar with that situation. Is my summary accurate?


Think so, yes, although I only know bits of information about the situation in the UK.

Nevertheless, here's a fresh article about these issues:

Flooding: five lessons we have learned
What our washed-out winter has taught us
Damian Carrington, The Observer, Sunday 2 February 2014

Main points in this article:
- Concrete is no longer a solution
- Soft flood defences mean hard choices
- Flood protection often works
- Cutting flood defence spending is a false economy
- Climate change appears to be hitting harder and faster than feared
Member Since: Posts: Comments:
Arctic Cyclones More Common Than Previously Thought

"From 2000 to 2010, about 1,900 cyclones churned across the top of the world each year, leaving warm water and air in their wakes – and melting sea ice in the Arctic Ocean.

That's about 40 percent more of these Arctic storms than previously thought..."


More at the link.
Member Since: December 21, 2013 Posts: 0 Comments: 231
Quoting 864. VAbeachhurricanes:


Oh... So a penny battery could kill a person...

Give me a break.


There needs to be a new economic term.

glamortize--the act of buying something outrageous, and way too expensive with an illogical justification. Like a $15,000 dress or the same jacking up your truck.

"Yes my new Coco Chanel dress is way too expensive but I'm going to glamortize it over the next 10 years!"
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Fukushima..

If you give me a fish I'll have food for a day.... If I eat that fish I'll be dead in a week...
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
Quoting 864. VAbeachhurricanes:


Oh... So a penny battery could kill a person...

Give me a break.


Very little amperage can kill a person....
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
Quoting 861. cyclonebuster:
My meter is 2,20,and 200 scale for milliamps so on scale 2 I would have to double my reading which would actually be 1.2 amps per penny....


Oh... So a penny battery could kill a person...

Give me a break.
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93 would light up a 100watt bulb...
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
Quoting 860. VAbeachhurricanes:



So you can light up a lightbulb with one penny battery?
Okay.


No but a hundred would...
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
My meter is 2,20,and 200 scale for milliamps so on scale 2 I would have to double my reading which would actually be 1.2 amps per penny....
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
Quoting 859. cyclonebuster:
I get 1,944 watts per hour per penny at 0.54 watt seconds......





I get 0.0060 on his graphic....



So you can light up a lightbulb with one penny battery?
Okay.
Member Since: Posts: Comments:
I get 1,944 watts per hour per penny at 0.54 watt seconds......





I get 0.60 miliamps or 600 miliamps on his graphic per penny.... OOPs added two to many zeros before the 6....
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
I get .54 joule seconds now...
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
I get .54 watts per penny.... Calculating joule seconds now.....
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
Quoting 854. VAbeachhurricanes:


Here you go.

Could a Penny Power a House?

Only if you have any anti-penny to combine with it.
Member Since: October 30, 2005 Posts: 7 Comments: 5469
Quoting 854. VAbeachhurricanes:


Here you go.

Could a Penny Power a House?


He got this value for 1 penny battery... "I suspect this is just a measurement error since the current values are so low (around 0.1 mA)."

I got 0.6 milliamps per penny battery... Checking his other data...
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
Quoting 849. cyclonebuster:


VAbeachhurricanes:,

I showed you how I got my figures show me how you got your figures?


Here you go.

Could a Penny Power a House?
Member Since: Posts: Comments:
Quoting 852. Astrometeor:


Amusement parks where roller coasters go upside down are great money holes too.


Cheaper for me to go to the bank and get $15.00 of new pennies...
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
Quoting 848. Naga5000:


Time to start raiding the fountains.


Amusement parks where roller coasters go upside down are great money holes too.
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851. yoboi
Quoting 848. Naga5000:


Time to start raiding the fountains.



LOL please don't give him any ideas.....
Member Since: August 25, 2010 Posts: 7 Comments: 2348
850. yoboi
Quoting 847. cyclonebuster:


I get 1500 penny batteries ( $15.00 ) gets me 120 volts and .9 amps for a year 24/7/365 continuous output...

I got .8 volts from it with .6 miliamps.... I figure if I wire 150 them in series I can get 120 volts DC with 90 miliamps.... I can then get a DC to AC converter and get some AC power from it.... If I scale it up to 1,500 pennies I can get 120Vac with it and .9 amps....If I scale it up again to 15,000 pennies with 120V ac I can get 9 amps from it..... Of course there would be some line losses but that is pretty significant if you run it 24/7/365.... It was very easy to do...




SMH
Member Since: August 25, 2010 Posts: 7 Comments: 2348
Quoting 848. Naga5000:


Time to start raiding the fountains.


VAbeachhurricanes:,

I showed you how I got my figures show me how you got your figures?
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
Quoting 845. VAbeachhurricanes:



To power an entire house for 2 days, you would need around $400,000 worth of pennies.

Time for your next invention.


Time to start raiding the fountains.
Member Since: June 1, 2010 Posts: 4 Comments: 3503
Quoting 845. VAbeachhurricanes:



To power an entire house for 2 days, you would need around $400,000 dollars worth of pennies.

Time for your next invention.


I get 1500 penny batteries ( $15.00 ) gets me 120 volts and .9 amps for a year 24/7/365 continuous output...

I got .8 volts from it with .6 miliamps.... I figure if I wire 150 them in series I can get 120 volts DC with 90 miliamps.... I can then get a DC to AC converter and get some AC power from it.... If I scale it up to 1,500 pennies I can get 120Vac with it and .9 amps....If I scale it up again to 15,000 pennies with 120V ac I can get 9 amps from it..... Of course there would be some line losses but that is pretty significant if you run it 24/7/365.... It was very easy to do...
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
Quoting 843. Birthmark:

And I thought I had a tough childhood!


I just tested an old copper penny from before 1983... I got .04 volts... The new penny post 1983 gave me .90 volts.... The new plated penny is 97.5% Zn inner core, 2.5% Cu outside plating ...
Member Since: January 2, 2006 Posts: 127 Comments: 20401
Quoting 842. cyclonebuster:


They didn't have zinc in pennies in my 6th grade...



To power an entire house for 2 days, you would need around $400,000 worth of pennies.

Time for your next invention.
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Weekend reading:

!!! Keystone XL Won't Worsen Climate Change, U.S. Says

Keystone Has Obama Trapped in His Own 5 Percent

This Is Not the Keystone Decision That You Think It Is

*** Climate-Change Skeptics Have a Right to Free Speech, Too Discuss.

*** UK floods: January rain breaks records in parts of England



Atlantic changes are warming Antarctic

* One planet, two stars: New research shows how circumbinary planets form

Making color: When two red photons make a blue photon

!!! New catalyst to convert greenhouse gases into chemicals

Piezoelectrics and butterflies: Now scientists know more about how the materials actually work

Mysterious ocean circles off the Baltic coast explained

!!! Lighting up in uniform: Study looks at what makes soldiers reach for a pack of cigarettes or not


*** Mass sea star deaths off US west coast puzzle scientists

*** Scientists study die-offs among bighorn sheep

Fascinating hidden world in cold waters off Alaska

!!! Dolphins in 'bad shape' after BP oil spill


* NC fracking panel sets drilling gap from homes

A Bird Flies South, and It's News

!!! Another MCHM spill reported at West Virginia's Freedom Industries

Babylonian tale of round ark draws ire from some Christian circles What's the big deal? Gilgamesh describes the ark as a cube.

************************************************* ************************************************** *******

The following articles are courtesy of etxwx:

* Restrooms or Wetlands: How Should Texas Spend BP Spill Money?

Report: Lower power reserve margin would be more economic for Texas

*** Dramatic shifts underway in Americas energy trade

* White House Releases Plan to Make Arctic Shipping Safer

Israel's Back-Up Gas Supply Floats Far Offshore

Train Carrying Fuel Oil Derails, Spills In Mississippi

Asia Buying Up Oil Assets In Americas

*** Record Brazil heat pressures crops, energy prices, government
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About RickyRood

I'm a professor at U Michigan and lead a course on climate change problem solving. These articles often come from and contribute to the course.