Volcanic Winter

By: Dr. Jeff Masters , 1:18 PM GMT on April 24, 2009

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"The sun was dark and its darkness lasted for eighteen months; each day it shone for about four hours; and still this light was only a feeble shadow; the fruits did not ripen and the wine tasted like sour grapes." As this Michael the Syrian quote regarding the weather of 536 A.D. demonstrates, a climate catastrophe that blots out the sun can really spoil your day. Procopius of Caesarea remarked: "During this year [536 A.D.] a most dread portent took place. For the sun gave forth its light without brightness. and it seemed exceedingly like the sun in eclipse, for the beams it shed were not clear." Many documents from 535 - 536 A.D.--the time of King Arthur in Britain--speak of the terrible "dry fog" or cloud of dust that obscured the sun, causing widespread crop failures in Europe, and summer frosts, drought, and famine in China. Tree ring studies in Europe confirm several years of very poor growth around that time, and ice cores from Greenland and Antarctica show highly elevated levels of atmospheric sulfuric acid dust existed.

Though some scientists believe the climate calamity of 535-536 A.D. was due to a comet or asteroid hitting the Earth, it is widely thought that the event was probably caused by the most massive volcanic eruption of the past 1500 years. This eruption threw so much sulfur dioxide (SO2) gas into the stratosphere that a "Volcanic Winter" resulted. Sulfur dioxide reacts with water to form sulfuric acid droplets (aerosol particles), which are highly reflective and reduce the amount of incoming sunlight. The potential eruption that led to the 535 - 536 A.D. climate calamity would have likely been a magnitude 7 event on the Volcanic Explosivity Index (VEI)--a "super colossal" eruption that one can expect to occur only once every 1000 years. The Volcanic Explosivity Index is a logarithmic scale like the Richter scale used to rate earthquakes, so a magnitude 7 eruption would eject ten times more material than the two largest eruptions of the past century--the magnitude 6 eruptions of Mt. Pinatubo in the Philippines (1991) and Novarupta in Alaska (1912).


Figure 1. An 18 km-high volcanic plume from one of a series of explosive eruptions of Mount Pinatubo beginning on 12 June 1991, viewed from Clark Air Base (about 20 km east of the volcano). Three days later, the most powerful eruption produced a plume that rose nearly 40 km, penetrating well into the stratosphere. Pinatubo's sulfur emissions cooled the Earth by about 1°F (0.5°C) for 1 - 2 years. (Photograph by David H. Harlow, USGS.)

Super-colossal eruptions
There has been only one other magnitude 7 "super-colossal" eruption in the past 1500 years--the massive eruption of the Indonesian volcano Tambora in 1815. The sulfur pumped by this eruption into the stratosphere dimmed sunlight so extensively that global temperatures fell by about 2°F (1°C) for 1 - 2 years afterward. This triggered the famed Year Without a Summer in 1816. Killing frosts and snow storms in May and June 1816 in Eastern Canada and New England caused widespread crop failures, and lake and river ice were observed as far south as Pennsylvania in July and August. The Tambora eruption was about 40% smaller than the 535 - 536 A.D. event, as measured by the number of sulfur aerosol particles deposited in Greenland ice cores.

In an article published in 2008 in the American Geophysical Union journal EOS, Dr. Ken Verosub of the University of California, Davis Department of Geology estimated that future eruptions capable of causing "Volcanic Winter" effects severe enough to depress global temperatures by 2°F (1°C) and trigger widespread crop failures for 1 - 2 years afterwards should occur about once every 200 - 300 years. Even a magnitude 6 eruption, such as the 1600 eruption of the Peruvian volcano Huaynaputina, can cause climatic change capable of killing millions of people. The Huaynaputina eruption is blamed for the Russian famine of 1601-1603, which killed over half a million people and led to the overthrow of Tsar Boris Godunov. Thankfully, the climatic impacts of all of these historic magnitude 6 and 7 eruptions have been relatively short-lived. After about two years, the sulfuric acid aerosol particles have settled out of the stratosphere, returning the climate to its former state.

Mega-colossal eruptions
Even more extreme eruptions have occurred in Earth's past--eruptions ten times more powerful than the Tambora eruption, earning a ranking of 8 out of 8 on the Volcanic Explosivity Index (VEI). These "mega-colossal" eruptions occur only about once every 10,000 years, but have much longer-lasting climatic effects and thus are a more significant threat to human civilization. According to the Toba Catastrophe Theory, a mega-colossal eruption at Toba Caldera, Sumatra, about 74,000 years ago, was 3500 times greater than the Tambora eruption. According to model simulations, an eruption this large can pump so much sulfur dioxide gas into the stratosphere that the atmosphere does not have the capacity to oxidize all the SO2 to sulfuric acid aerosol. The atmosphere oxidizes as much SO2 as it can, leaving a huge reservoir of SO2 in the stratosphere. This SO2 gradually reacts to form sulfuric acid as the OH radicals needed for this reaction are gradually produced. The result is a much longer-lasting climate effect than the 1 - 2 years that the magnitude 6 and 7 events of 535, 1600, 1815, and 1991 lasted. A magnitude 8 eruption like the Toba event can cool the globe for 6 - 10 years (Figure 3), which may be long enough to trigger an ice age--if the climate is already on the verge of tipping into an ice age. Rampino and Self (1992) argued that the sulfur aerosol veil from Toba was thick and long-lasting enough to cool the globe by 3 - 5°C (5 - 9°F), pushing the climate--which was already cooling and perhaps headed towards an ice age--into a full-scale ice age. They suggested that the response of Canada to the volcano played a particularly important role, with their model predicting a 12°C (22°F) reduction in summer temperatures in Canada. This would have favored the growth of the Laurentide ice sheet, increasing the reflectivity (albedo) of the Earth, reflecting more sunlight and reducing temperatures further. The controversial Toba Catastrophe Theory asserts that the resulting sudden climate change reduced the Earth's population of humans to 1,000 - 10,000 breeding pairs. More recent research has shed considerable doubt on the idea that the Toba eruption pushed the climate into an ice age, though. Oppenheimer (2002) found evidence supporting only a 2°F (1.1°C) cooling of the globe, for the 1000 years after the Toba eruption. Zielinski et al. (1996) argued that the Toba eruption did not trigger a major ice age--the eruption merely pushed the globe into a cool period that lasted 200 years. Interestingly, a previous super-eruption of Toba, 788,000 years ago, coincided with a transition from an ice age to a warm period.


Figure 2. The 100x30 square kilometer Toba Caldera is situated in north-central Sumatra around 200 km north of the Equator. It is comprised of four overlapping calderas aligned with the Sumatran volcanic chain. Repeated volcanic cataclysms culminated in the stupendous expulsion of the Younger Toba Tuff around 74,000 years ago. The lake area is 100 square kilometers. Samosir Island formed as a result of subsequent uplift above the evacuated magma reservoir. Such resurgent domes are typically seen as the concluding phase of a large eruption. Landsat Enhanced Thematic Mapper Plus (ETM+) browse images for path/row 128/58 (6 September 1999) and 129/58 (21 January 2001) from http://landsat7.usgs.gov/. Copyright USGS. Image source: Oppenheimer, C., 2002, "Limited global change due to the largest known Quaternary eruption, Toba 74 kyr BP?"Quaternary Science Reviews, 21, Issues 14-15, August 2002, Pages 1593-1609.


Figure 3. Total mass of sulfur dioxide and sulfate aerosol in the stratosphere (heavy solid and dotted lines, respectively) modeled for a 6 petagram stratospheric injection of SO2. Observed SO2 and aerosol mass for the 1991 Pinatubo eruption are shown for comparison. The much larger amount of SO2 in the Toba simulation soaks up all available oxidants in the stratosphere leading to a much longer lifetime of SO2 and, in turn, prolonging the manufacture of sulfate aerosol. Data from Read et al. (1993) and Bekki et al. (1996). Image source: Oppenheimer, C., 2002, "Limited global change due to the largest known Quaternary eruption, Toba 74 kyr BP?"Quaternary Science Reviews, 21, Issues 14-15, August 2002, Pages 1593-1609.

When can we expect the next mega-colossal eruption?
Given the observed frequency of one mega-colossal magnitude 8 volcanic eruption every 1.4 million years, the odds of another hitting in the next 100 years is about .014%, according to Mason et al., 2004. This works out to a 1% chance over the next 7200 years. Rampino (2002) puts the average frequency of such eruptions at once every 50,000 years--about double the frequency with which 1-km diameter comets or asteroids capable of causing a similar climatic effect hit the Earth. A likely location for the next mega-colossal eruption would be at the Yellowstone Caldera in Wyoming, which has had magnitude 7 or 8 eruptions as often as every 650,000 years. The last mega-colossal eruption there was about 640,000 years ago. But don't worry, the seismic activity under Yellowstone Lake earlier this year has died down, and the uplift of the ground over the Yellowstone caldera that was as large as 7 cm/yr (2.7 inches/yr) between 2004 - 2006 has now fallen to 4 cm/yr, according to the Yellowstone Volcano Observatory. The USGS states that "the Yellowstone volcanic system shows no signs that it is headed toward such an eruption. The probability of a large caldera-forming eruption within the next few thousand years is exceedingly low".

What would happen if a magnitude 8 mega-colossal eruption were to occur today?
If a mega-colossal eruption were to occur today, it would probably not be able to push Earth into an ice age, according to a modeling study done by Jones et al. (2005). They found that an eruption like Toba would cool the Earth by about 17°F (9.4°C) after the first year (Figure 3), and the temperature would gradually recover to 3°F (1.8°C) below normal ten years after the eruption. They found that the eruption would reduce rainfall by 50% globally for the first two years, and up to 90% over the Amazon, Southeast Asia, and central Africa. This would obviously be very bad for human civilization, with the cold and lack of sunshine causing widespread crop failures and starvation of millions of people. Furthermore, the eruption would lead to a partial loss of Earth's protective ozone layer, allowing highly damaging levels of ultraviolet light to penetrate to the surface.

Not even a mega-colossal eruption of this magnitude would stop global warming, though. The level of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere would not be affected by the volcanic eruption, and warming would resume where it left off once the stratospheric dust settled out in a decade. With civilization crippled by the disaster, greenhouse gas emissions would be substantially reduced, though (small solace!) If we really want to say goodbye to civilization, a repeat of the only magnitude 9 eruption in recorded history should do the trick--the magnitude 9.2 La Garita, Colorado blast of 27.8 million years ago (Mason et al., 2004).


Figure 4. Annual near-surface temperature anomalies for the year following a mega-colossal volcanic eruption like the Toba eruption of 74,000 years ago, if it were to occur today. Most land areas cool by 22°F (12°C) compared to average. Some areas, like Africa, cool by 29°F (16°C). Image credit: Jones, G.S., et al., 2005, "An AOGCM simulation of the climate response to a volcanic super-eruption", Climate Dynamics, 25, Numbers 7-8, pp 725-738, December, 2005.

What would happen if a magnitude 7 super-colossal eruption were to occur today?
An eruption today like the magnitude 7 events of 535 A.D. or 1815 would cause cause wide-spread crop failures for 1 - 2 years after the eruption. With food supplies in the world already stretched thin by rising population, decreased water availability, and conversion of cropland to grow biofuels, a major volcanic eruption would probably create widespread famine, threatening the lives of millions of people. Wars over scarce resources might result. However, society's vulnerability to major volcanic eruptions is less than it was, since the globe has warmed significantly in the past 200 years. The famines from the eruptions of 1600 and 1815 both occurred during the Little Ice Age, when global temperatures were about 1.4°F (0.8°C) cooler than today. Crop failures would not be as wide-spread with today's global temperatures, if a suer-colossal eruption were to occur. Fifty years from now, when global temperatures are expected to be at least 1°C warmer, a magnitude 7 eruption should only be able to cool the climate down to year 2009 levels.

Volcanoes also warm the climate
While volcanoes cool the climate on time scales of 1 - 2 years, they act to warm the climate over longer time scales, since they are an important source of natural CO2 to the atmosphere. Volcanoes add 0.1 - 0.3 gigatons (Gt) of carbon to the atmosphere each year, which is about 1 - 3% of what human carbon emissions to the atmosphere were in 2007, according to the Global Carbon Project. In fact, volcanoes are largely responsible for the natural CO2 in the atmosphere, and helped make life possible on Earth. Why, then, haven't CO2 levels continuously risen over geologic time, turning Earth into a steamy hothouse? In fact, CO2 levels have fallen considerably since the time of the dinosaurs--how can this be? Well, volcano-emitted CO2 is removed from the atmosphere by chemical weathering. This occurs when rain and snow fall on rocks containing silicates. The moisture and silicates react with CO2, pulling it out of the air. The carbon removed from the air is then washed into the sea, where it ends up in ocean sediments that gradually harden into rock. Rates of chemical weathering on Earth have accelerated since the time of the dinosaurs, largely due to the recent uplift of the Himalaya Mountains and Tibetan Plateau. These highlands undergo a tremendous amount of weathering, thanks to their lofty heights and the rains of the Asian Monsoon that they capture. Unfortunately, chemical weathering cannot help us with our current high levels of greenhouse gases, since chemical weathering takes thousands of years to remove significant amounts of CO2 from the atmosphere. It takes about 100,000 years for silicate weathering to remove 63% of the CO2 in the atmosphere. Thus, climate models predict that chemical weathering will solve our greenhouse gas problem in about 100,000 - 200,000 years.

For further information
PBS TV special on the 535-536 A.D. disaster.
Newspaper articles on the 535-536 A.D. disaster.
Volcanic winter article from wikipedia.
Realclimate.org has a nice article that goes into the volcano-climate connection in greater detail.

References
Bekki, S., J.A. Pyle, W. Zhong, R. Toumi, J.D. Haigh and D.M. Pyle, 1996, "The role of microphysical and chemical processes in prolonging the climate forcing of the Toba eruption", Geophysical Research Letters 23 (1996), pp. 2669-2672.

Jones, G.S., et al., 2005, "An AOGCM simulation of the climate response to a volcanic super-eruption", Climate Dynamics, 25, Numbers 7-8, pp 725-738, December, 2005.

Rampino, M.R., and S. Self, 1993, "Climate-volcanism feedback and the Toba eruption of 74,000 years ago", Quaternary Research 40 (1993), pp. 269-280.

Mason, B.G., D.M. Pyle, and C. Oppenheimer, 2004, "The size and frequency of the largest observed explosive eruptions on Earth", Bulletin of Volcanology" 66, Number 8, December 2004, pp 735-748.

Oppenheimer, C., 2002, "Limited global change due to the largest known Quaternary eruption, Toba 74 kyr BP?"Quaternary Science Reviews, 21, Issues 14-15, August 2002, Pages 1593-1609.

Rampino, M.R., 2002, "Supereruptions as a Threat to Civilizations on Earth-like Planets", Icarus, 156, Issue 2, April 2002, Pages 562-569.

Read, W.G., L. Froidevaux and J.W. Waters, 1993, "Microwave Limb Sounder measurements of stratospheric SO2 from the Mt. Pinatubo eruption", Geophysical Research Letters 20 (1993), pp. 1299-1302.

Verosub, K.L., and J. Lippman, 2008, "Global Impacts of the 1600 Eruption of Peru's Huaynaputina Volcano", EOS 89, 15, 8 April 2008, pp 141-142.

Zielinski, G.A. et al., 1996, "Potential Atmospheric Impact of the Toba Mega-Eruption 71,000 Years Ago", Geophysical Research Letters, 23, 8, pp. 837-840, 1996.

Portlight moves to provide relief for South Carolina wildfires
South Carolina's biggest wildfire in more than three decades --a blaze four miles wide--destroyed dozens of homes near Myrtle Beach yesterday. Portlight Strategies, Inc. is preparing to respond to this disaster, focusing on providing drinks and sanitary products to firefighters, particularly to rural volunteer fire departments and other first responders which do not have the same resources as some of the larger paid departments. To help out, visit the Portlight South Carolina fire relief web page. Thanks!

Jeff Masters

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Quoting CatastrophicDL:

Never happened. Can't find a record of it ever. If a hurricane got too close, the equator would kill it. It couldn't spin clockwise north of the equator. The coriolis force would be too weak to keep any rotation going.


Yes, that's what I think also. :)
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Quoting moonlightcowboy:

Curious - has this ever happened before - a storm crossing into either hemisphere?

Never happened. Can't find a record of it ever. If a hurricane got too close, the equator would kill it. It couldn't spin clockwise north of the equator. The coriolis force would be too weak to keep any rotation going.
Member Since: September 3, 2007 Posts: 3 Comments: 1519
Quoting KEEPEROFTHEGATE:
on may 15 1951 we had a cat 3 hurricane able form


That, in my opinion, is the craziest storm ever. Especially since it attained the cat 3 status so far north-- in MAY.
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Koritheman - That's good to hear your prepared..and luckily no one lose their lives!
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Quoting Beachfoxx:
Destin Dog Walk -------

Awesome!!!!

And my little Shadow was the STAR on the local news!!!!!!!

Oh, he was so cute!!!

Thank you WU for your support!!!!!!!!!

((BFOXX)), glad it went great. Where are the pictures though? Need pics!

btw - hulluva nice avatar! ;P
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Quoting KEEPEROFTHEGATE:
on may 15 1951 we had a cat 3 hurricane able form


True Dat...
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1278. KEEPEROFTHEGATE (Mod)
Quoting CaneAddict:
1257. Cotillion 2:57 AM GMT on April 27, 2009

That's true, May has had it's number of tropical systems and if conditions are right I see no reason for a tropical storm to develop..
on may 15 1951 we had a cat 3 hurricane able form
Member Since: July 15, 2006 Posts: 171 Comments: 53862
Quoting CaneAddict:


I'm doing great other than getting in a car accident Monday..thank god, i'm alright! All prepared for the season yet?


A car accident? That sucks, dude. Glad to hear you're okay. Any time a life is lost, the community where the person lived will never be the same, even if others think that it will.

And yeah, I'm as prepared as I'm going to get.
Member Since: March 7, 2007 Posts: 576 Comments: 20612
Quoting naplesdreamer28:
I love how when anything forms anywhere in the Atlantic to the Gulf, Florida always ends up being a target in someone's eyes.


Haha...yeah, Last year JFV was hell-bent on I believe IKE nailing SW Florida..and what a concidence, He lives there!
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Destin Dog Walk -------

Awesome!!!!

And my little Shadow was the STAR on the local news!!!!!!!

Oh, he was so cute!!!

Thank you WU for your support!!!!!!!!!
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Quoting KoritheMan:


I'm quite alright! Yourself?


I'm doing great other than getting in a car accident Monday..thank god, i'm alright! All prepared for the season yet?
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I love how when anything forms anywhere in the Atlantic to the Gulf, Florida always ends up being a target in someone's eyes.
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1272. hahaguy
Quoting KoritheMan:


Wrong, mate.

It's clearly aiming for NOLA.


Ah , your right it is. LOL
Member Since: August 12, 2007 Posts: 2 Comments: 2838
Quoting hahaguy:


I'm just waiting for someone to say "is it going to hit florida". LOL


Wrong, mate.

It's clearly aiming for NOLA.
Member Since: March 7, 2007 Posts: 576 Comments: 20612
Some scary storm to watch in the middle of the GOM...Wow.

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Quoting bappit:
interesting ...

TC 27 is forecast to cross the equator.

Curious - has this ever happened before - a storm crossing into either hemisphere?
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1268. hahaguy
Quoting naplesdreamer28:
Pretty soon we'll hear Florida has a storm coming. lol


I'm just waiting for someone to say "is it going to hit florida". LOL
Member Since: August 12, 2007 Posts: 2 Comments: 2838
Quoting Ossqss:
MLC, were ya using 8 ??? I did not have to revert, but I am on IE 6+, no choice on my end. :(

Recently upgraded (reluctantly) to FF 3.0.9
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Pretty soon we'll hear Florida has a storm coming. lol
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Quoting CaneAddict:
1236. KoritheMan 2:29 AM GMT on April 27, 2009

Exactly! And anyways, How are you Kori?


I'm quite alright! Yourself?
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Boy SST's are starting to bubble a bit.
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LOL...54 minutes now.
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I'm not counting on a storm to come out of the solution the GFS is currently showing but...that model is pretty well-cordinated when it comes to potential development and it has done quite well...I won't disregard it just yet...i'll continue to watch it for persistence and if other models do come on board we may have something to watch for.
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1261. hahaguy
Quoting KEEPEROFTHEGATE:
58 mins till jfv checks in to ask if latest run is out yet


Oh god don't remind me.
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1260. KEEPEROFTHEGATE (Mod)
58 mins till jfv checks in to ask if latest run is out yet
Member Since: July 15, 2006 Posts: 171 Comments: 53862
1257. Cotillion 2:57 AM GMT on April 27, 2009

That's true, May has had it's number of tropical systems and if conditions are right I see no reason for a tropical storm to develop..
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1236. KoritheMan 2:29 AM GMT on April 27, 2009

Exactly! And anyways, How are you Kori?
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Quoting KoritheMan:


Hmm, okay. Well, either way, the first period since then. That's over 70 years. That alone makes this potential event meteorologically remarkable.


Quite, just like the 1933/2005 bumper seasons. Did a post about May storms a few blogs back, they're not as infrequent as they're made out to be.
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Quoting KoritheMan:


Hmm, okay. Well, either way, the first period since then. That's over 70 years. That alone makes this potential event meteorologically remarkable.


Well, we have been in active period since 1995 so it's not that unbelievable. We also have been getting more frequent December storms (Olga, Zeta, Epsilon, Odette, Peter), and those are only from the past 5 years or so.
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If anyone would like to view the values input and give some feedback it is located at...

http://tampaspinsweather.webs.com/

Then go to TROPICAL PREDICTION ANALYSIS and then click Daily Tropical Analysis 1 at the bottom!
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Quoting Cotillion:


Not quite.

Check 1932-34. That also had 3 straight May storms.


Hmm, okay. Well, either way, the first period since then. That's over 70 years. That alone makes this potential event meteorologically remarkable.
Member Since: March 7, 2007 Posts: 576 Comments: 20612
Quoting TampaSpin:
I just plugged in the values on my Model and it came up with 23% of development.


That's fairly high, given the time of year.
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Quoting KoritheMan:


I'm not saying that a pre-season storm is an extreme rarity, just that it is an extreme rarity to see a pre-season storm three years in a row. If this happens, I think it will be the first time within the Atlantic historical record that such an event has occurred.


Not quite.

Check 1932-34. That also had 3 straight May storms.
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I just plugged in the values on my Model and it came up with 23% of development.
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Quoting Ossqss:
Sent it over Florida, we need it badly. That would be a perfect fit for our extensive rainfall shortfall. We can only hope we find a weak system that takes its time over us. My lake is at a 20 yr. low.


Exactly my thoughts and extinguish our fires for good.
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South Florida watch out! It's been four years since Wilma (I'm not counting Ernesto or Fay because they were tropical storms). I wouldn't be surprised if the gulf got a break for the next couple of years based off this picture.
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1248. beell
night time inversion-leading to the beam bouncing back off the underside of the inversion. As StormW noted, this phenonmenon is most prevalent in clear-air mode.
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KoritheMan IM me thank you
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Quoting weatherblog:


I think if this were to form it would be really cool. If this were August, I'd be scared of something forming there but this is May so we obviously don't have to worry about a major hurricane.

However, it's not all THAT of a rarity to have a pre-season storm. If we all remember, in the past two years, they both had May systems (Andrea, Arthur). A couple years before that they had Anna, and so on...

I'm not totally ruling this out. If the conditions are right, what's stopping it?


I'm not saying that a pre-season storm is an extreme rarity, just that it is an extreme rarity to see a pre-season storm three years in a row. If this happens, I think it will be the first time within the Atlantic historical record that such an event has occurred.
Member Since: March 7, 2007 Posts: 576 Comments: 20612
Quoting beell:
1236. it is fun to speculate and watch.

Anybody says they ain't watchin' is lying!


So true. :)
Member Since: March 7, 2007 Posts: 576 Comments: 20612
1244. Ossqss
Sent it over Florida, we need it badly. That would be a perfect fit for our extensive rainfall shortfall. We can only hope we find a weak system that takes its time over us. My lake is at a 20 yr. low.
Member Since: June 12, 2005 Posts: 6 Comments: 8186
1243. KEEPEROFTHEGATE (Mod)
Quoting naplesdreamer28:
That is one strange national radar!
just fog
Member Since: July 15, 2006 Posts: 171 Comments: 53862
Climatolgy if anything was develop one would have to say it was right where its suppose to be for Development early!

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Quoting KoritheMan:
18Z GFS is out, and seems to be hinting at a large surge of moisture across the Pacific side of Central America around May 3 or 4. Subsequently, that energy is forecast to shift into the southwestern Caribbean and could possibly become a tropical cyclone at that point (around May 7).

If anything develops at all though, it will likely only be a rain producer. I'm still highly skeptical of any tropical cyclogenesis in this area, despite the GFS's consistency. And anyone here that knows me even a little should know that I'm not trying to raise panic, I'm just pointing out an area of potential interest, since it is the pre-season warmup, with the actual season right around the center.

I also notice that the 18z GFS forecasts some rather favorable upper-level winds across throughout the Caribbean right around May 7. Again, nothing is likely to come of this, but nonetheless, it is fun to speculate and watch.


I think if this were to form it would be really cool. If this were August, I'd be scared of something forming there but this is May so we obviously don't have to worry about a major hurricane.

However, it's not all THAT of a rarity to have a pre-season storm. If we all remember, in the past two years, they both had May systems (Andrea, Arthur). A couple years before that they had Anna, and so on...

I'm not totally ruling this out. If the conditions are right, what's stopping it?
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1239. beell
1236. it is fun to speculate and watch.

Heck, I wouldn't worry about it Kori. What ever the case with the GFS-it's almost impossible to not keep up with this thing! Anybody says they ain't watchin' is lying!
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That is one strange national radar!
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18Z GFS is out, and seems to be hinting at a large surge of moisture across the Pacific side of Central America around May 3 or 4. Subsequently, that energy is forecast to shift into the southwestern Caribbean and could possibly become a tropical cyclone at that point (around May 7).

If anything develops at all though, it will likely only be a rain producer. I'm still highly skeptical of any tropical cyclogenesis in this area, despite the GFS's consistency. And anyone here that knows me even a little should know that I'm not trying to raise panic, I'm just pointing out an area of potential interest, since it is the pre-season warmup, with the actual season right around the center.

I also notice that the 18z GFS forecasts some rather favorable upper-level winds across throughout the Caribbean right around May 7. Again, nothing is likely to come of this, but nonetheless, it is fun to speculate and watch.
Member Since: March 7, 2007 Posts: 576 Comments: 20612
Quoting Ossqss:


Oh, that means you have the PC version of swine flu. Not

did ya reboot? or dump your temp files, not cookies !


YEp did it.....i give.
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1234. Ossqss
MLC, were ya using 8 ??? I did not have to revert, but I am on IE 6+, no choice on my end. :(
Member Since: June 12, 2005 Posts: 6 Comments: 8186

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Jeff co-founded the Weather Underground in 1995 while working on his Ph.D. He flew with the NOAA Hurricane Hunters from 1986-1990.