Is U.S. climate getting more extreme?

By: Dr. Jeff Masters , 1:54 PM GMT on March 13, 2009

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Is the climate in the U.S. getting more extreme? The answer to this question depends upon how one defines "extreme". For example, the number of extreme tornadoes (violent EF-4 and EF-5 twisters) has not increased in recent years. We lack the data to judge whether there has been an increase in severe thunderstorms and hail. There has been a marked increase in Atlantic hurricane activity since 1995 (though the possible contribution of human-caused global warming to this increase is not something hurricane scientists agree upon). Since it is difficult to quantify how severe storms like tornadoes and hurricanes are changing, a better measure of how climate extremes are changing is to look at temperature and precipitation, which are well-measured. NOAA's National Climatic Data Center (NCDC) has developed a Climate Extremes Index to attempt to quantify whether or not the U.S. climate is getting more extreme. The Climate Extremes Index (CEI) is based upon three parameters:

1) Monthly maximum and minimum temperature
2) Daily precipitation
3) Monthly Palmer Drought Severity Index (PDSI)

The temperature data is taken from 1100 stations in the U.S. Historical Climatology Network (USHCN), a network of stations that have a long period of record, with little missing data. The temperature data is corrected for the Urban Heat Island effect, as well as for station and instrument changes. The precipitation data is taken from 1300 National Weather Service Cooperative stations. The Climate Extremes Index defines "much above normal" as the highest 10% of data, "much below normal" as the lowest 10%, and is the average of these five quantities:

1) The sum of (a) percentage of the United States with maximum temperatures much below normal and (b) percentage of the United States with maximum temperatures much above normal.

2) The sum of (a) percentage of the United States with minimum temperatures much below normal and (b) percentage of the United States with minimum temperatures much above normal.

3) The sum of (a) percentage of the United States in severe drought (equivalent to the lowest tenth percentile) based on the Palmer Drought Severity Index (PDSI) and (b) percentage of the United States with severe moisture surplus (equivalent to the highest tenth percentile) based on the PDSI.

4) Twice the value of the percentage of the United States with a much greater than normal proportion of precipitation derived from extreme (equivalent to the highest tenth percentile) 1-day precipitation events.

5) The sum of (a) percentage of the United States with a much greater than normal number of days with precipitation and (b) percentage of the United States with a much greater than normal number of days without precipitation.


Figure 1. The Annual Climate Extremes Index (CEI), updated through 2008, shows that U.S. climate has been getting more extreme since the early 1970s. Image credit: National Climatic Data Center. On average since 1910, 20% of the U.S. has seen extreme conditions in a given year (thick black line).

As summarized by Gleason et al. (2008), the National Climatic Data Center concludes that based on the Climate Extremes Index, the percentage of the U.S. seeing extreme temperatures and precipitation generally increased since the early 1970s. These increases were most pronounced in the summer. No trend in extremes were noted for winter. The annual CEI index plot averaged for all five temperature and precipitation indices (Figure 1) showed that five of the fifteen most extreme years on record occurred since 1997. Shorter-lived periods with high CEI values occurred in the 1930s and 1950s, in association with widespread extreme drought and above-average temperatures. The most extreme year in U.S. history was 1998, with 1934 a close second. The year 1998 was the hottest year in U.S. history, with a record 78% of the U.S. experiencing minimum temperatures much above normal. That year also had a record 23% of the U.S. with much greater than normal precipitation from extreme 1-day precipitation events. The 1934 extreme in CEI was due in large part because of the most widespread drought of the century--a full 52% of the U.S. was affected by severe or extreme drought conditions. That year also saw a record 64% of the U.S. with much above normal maximum temperatures.

The impact of maximum and minimum temperatures on the Climate Extreme Index
It is very interesting to look at the five separate indices that go into the Climate Extremes Index. Today I'll look at temperature, and next week, I'll focus on drought and precipitation. The portion of the U.S. experiencing month-long maximum temperatures either much above normal or much below normal has been about 10% over the past century (black lines in Figure 2). However, over the past decade, about 20-25% of the U.S. has been experiencing monthly maximum temperatures much above normal, and the portion of the U.S. experiencing much colder than normal high temperatures has been near zero. Minimum temperatures show a similar behavior, but have increased more than the maximums (Figure 3). Over the past decade, minimum temperatures much above normal have affected 25-35% of the U.S. This means that the daily range of temperature (difference between minimum and maximum) has decreased over the past decade, which is what global warming says should be happening if greenhouse gases are primarily to blame for the rise in temperatures.

While there have been a few years (1921, 1934) when the portion of the U.S. experiencing much above normal maximum temperatures was greater than anything observed in the past decade, the sustained lack of maximum temperatures much below normal over the past decade is unique. The behavior of minimum temperatures over the past decade is clearly unprecedented--both in the lack of minimum temperatures much below normal, and in the abnormal portion of the U.S. with much above normal minimum temperatures. Remember that these data ARE corrected for the Urban Heat Island effect, so we cannot blame increased urbanization on the increase in temperatures. Recall that the all-time record maximum and minimum temperature data, which I presented in a post in February, are not corrected for the Urban Heat Island Effect, but look very similar to the CEI maximum and minimum temperature trends presented here.

A lot of people have told me that they believe we are experiencing more wild swings of temperature from hot to cold from day to day in recent years, but the CEI data does not answer this question. To my knowledge, a study of this kind has not been done.


Figure 2. The Annual Climate Extremes Index (CEI) for maximum temperature, updated through 2008, shows that 20-25% of U.S. has had maximum temperatures much above normal over the past decade. Image credit: National Climatic Data Center.


Figure 3. The Annual Climate Extremes Index (CEI) for minimum temperature, updated through 2008, shows that 25-35% of U.S. has had minimum temperatures much above normal over the past decade. Image credit: National Climatic Data Center.

References
Gleason, K.L., J.H. Lawrimore, D.H. Levinson, T.R. Karl, and D.J. Karoly, 2008: "A Revised U.S. Climate Extremes Index", J. Climate, 21, 2124-2137.

Annual WeatherDance contest ready for registration!
Armchair forecasters, now's your chance to shine! WeatherDance, based on teams in the men's and women's NCAA basketball tournaments, allows players to predict which team's city will be hotter or colder on game day in each round of the Big Dance. Beginning today, players can make their forecasts at the Weather Dance Web site at: www.weatherdance.org. The site will be updated with cities promptly after NCAA seeding announcements. First round Weather Dance selections must be entered by 11:59 p.m. EDT Wednesday, March 18.

"Officially, Weather Dance began as a class project to get students involved in weather forecasting, but we kept it around because it got popular. People think they can do better forecasting than the meteorologists. Well, here's their shot!" said Perry Samson, WeatherDance creator, co-founder of the The Weather Underground, Inc., and Professor in the Department of Atmospheric, Oceanic and Space Sciences at the University of Michigan.

This is the fifth year for the game. Last year more than 2,000 people played. Most play merely for the thrill, but many K-12 science teachers involve their classes as part of meteorology units. The winning teacher will receive an expense-paid trip to join the Texas Tech/University of Michigan Storm Chasing team this spring for a day of tornado chasing in Tornado Alley. Other winners will receive a Weather Underground umbrella, "Extreme Weather" mugs, or a copy of the book "Extreme Weather," by Christopher C. Burt.

I'll talk about drought and precipitation trends in my next post, Monday or Tuesday.

Jeff Masters

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122. HTV
You might want to bookmark this sight.
allmyfaves.com
WU is listed here also
121. Skyepony (Mod)
Red Alert! Drought empties Tampa Bay's drinking reservoir
March 14, 2009 at 7:28 am by Wayne Garcia
From Craig Pittman at the Times:

As of this week, Tampa Bay Water has virtually drained its 15 billion-gallon reservoir. From now until the summer rainy season, it must rely on its two remaining sources of water: its sometimes troubled desalination plant and the dwindling supply in the underground aquifer.

“It’s going to be a long couple of months waiting for the rainy season,” Tampa Bay Water spokeswoman Michelle Robinson said Friday.

The regional utility expects to again ask the Southwest Florida Water Management District to impose the toughest watering restrictions in history on Pinellas, Pasco and Hillsborough county residents. Swiftmud turned down that request last month - but that was before the reservoir ran out.

Member Since: August 10, 2005 Posts: 208 Comments: 39049
stand up forecaster not arm chair forecaster. thank you very much happy weather
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Tampaspin, what do you think will happen this hurricane season? Are you leaning toward active or quiet?
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118. Skyepony (Mod)
That's a pretty convincing clothesline graph..

I should have saved the potentail map from lastnight, it has since changed.
Member Since: August 10, 2005 Posts: 208 Comments: 39049
46*F in Macon, Ga this morning, storm system slowly headed our way. Have recently discovered photographic proof of Global Warming. Cannot verify its scientific accuracy.

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Happy Pi Day everyone ! What kind of Pie will you be having today to celebrate Pi Day?
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I just updated my Web Site and my WU Blog if anyone would like to view...

http://tampaspinsweather.webs.com/index.htm

TampaSpins Weather Blog Link
Member Since: September 2, 2007 Posts: 179 Comments: 20448
114. Skyepony (Mod)
The low in the mid atlantic is down to 1002mb.

Has the most potental in the NH..


80 something days left til 'cane season..
Member Since: August 10, 2005 Posts: 208 Comments: 39049
Just wanted to come on and notify everyone that over the coming weeks, the CCHS WEATHER CENTER site will be undergoing some changes.

At this time, I'm working on adding a Blog Feature to the site in order to provide faster updates and insight into any weather news, active tropical systems, or innovations. Just as with CaneAddict's site, you will need to register as a member in order to comment. On the Home page, you will see a tool that will allow you to register as a member.

Over the coming weeks, I'm going to attempt to establish a video blog like Frank Strait from Accuweather.com has so that I could provide analysis of the current weather situation at the time. If anyone could provide any information on how to establish one and the resources I will need to be able to create a video blog, I would greatly appreciate it.

Well, have a good night everyone and I should have my first blog entry on the CCHS Weather Center site sometime this weekend.
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Later, all.

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Quoting atmoaggie:


Dunno. The one for 1911-1920 just came out last year, so it could be later this year, depending on available time.

http://www.aoml.noaa.gov/hrd/Landsea/reanal_1911-20.pdf


Yeah, I noticed that the last info released was a year ago. I'm just curious about the new info.
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Great Depression! Global hurricane activity reaches new lows.

Interesting article
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Quoting atmoaggie:


I don't know that we can't. No we don't abandon the idea, we research it's viability.

I was not trying to be combative, just asking questions.


Understood, my problem is I have more questions than answers and real answers are hard to find on this and many other subjects.
We all know what we think we want, but I like to be sure before I get it. CUL8R º¿ª
Member Since: June 12, 2005 Posts: 6 Comments: 8188
Hey all...been pretty much lurking. Last night I let everyone know I was upgrading my site and have added a feature to register by email. This prevents fools from posting immature or innapropiate material on my site...Please register so you can join in on the discussion this season..also I will be releasing features exclusively for site members!

CaneWatch Hurricane Center
Click on "Register" on the top right of the home page.
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Quoting 1900hurricane:
Does anyone know when the hurricane reanalysis for the '20s and '30s comes out?


Dunno. The one for 1911-1920 just came out last year, so it could be later this year, depending on available time.

http://www.aoml.noaa.gov/hrd/Landsea/reanal_1911-20.pdf
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Quoting Ossqss:


So we just abaondon the idea?

And how do you know we can't/ That's what I am asking.

A better question is, how do you intend to off load onto any other energy source the load the human race requires. Ensure you provide an easy path for those larger, future users who are now desiring more of which we want to limit.


I don't know that we can't. No we don't abandon the idea, we research it's viability.

I was not trying to be combative, just asking questions.
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Does anyone know when the hurricane reanalysis for the '20s and '30s comes out?
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RE: 95. AussieStorm
Contained!!!! Happy Dance!!!

92. Skyepony
The CDC does not list pollution as a leading cause of death in the USA. I would think that cardiac and respiratory disease would include those deaths due to or in part due to pollution. Of course those categories would include all other types of cardiac and respiratory diseases as well.

CDC - Deaths/Mortality - 2005 Number of deaths for leading causes of death:
Heart disease: 652,091
Cancer: 559,312
Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 143,579
Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 130,933
Accidents (unintentional injuries): 117,809 (Motor vehicle traffic-related injuries resulted in 43,667 deaths)
Diabetes: 75,119
Alzheimer's disease: 71,599
Influenza/Pneumonia: 63,001
Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome, and nephrosis: 43,901
Septicemia: 34,136

The question of course is how much of the cardio-respiratory is due to
1) Directly to pollution
2) Pollution as a contributing cause
3) Other cause of cardio-respiratory disease

And..how and who is making that determination ;)
Member Since: August 19, 2008 Posts: 6 Comments: 2490
Quoting atmoaggie:


Do you really think we could sequester on a scale needed to make an impact?

Better than the tropical forests expanding the size of the trees?

Link
Fifth of world carbon emissions soaked up by extra forest growth, scientists find

"Trees in the tropics are getting bigger, which means they are soaking up an extra 5bn tonnes of CO2 a year"

I hear ya about the entitlements, bailouts, mortgages, etc. We are all paying, and going to be paying for a long time, for a house of cards to support all of those living beyond their means (note: they still are!). It strikes me as a very left-wing thing to do.


So we just abaondon the idea?

And how do you know we can't/ That's what I am asking.

A better question is, how do you intend to off load onto any other energy source the load the human race requires. Ensure you provide an easy path for those larger, future users who are now desiring more of which we want to limit.
Member Since: June 12, 2005 Posts: 6 Comments: 8188
Quoting Ossqss:


Gov also supports the bill for ethanol and entitlements etc. Its all our money thats getting spent anyway you look at it. How about the mortgage and bank bailouts. Same thing.

Will carbon sequestration help us and is it worth it? Does it squelch the CO2 issue and extend out ability to have our creature comforts?


Do you really think we could sequester on a scale needed to make an impact?

Better than the tropical forests expanding the size of the trees?

Link
Fifth of world carbon emissions soaked up by extra forest growth, scientists find

"Trees in the tropics are getting bigger, which means they are soaking up an extra 5bn tonnes of CO2 a year"

I hear ya about the entitlements, bailouts, mortgages, etc. We are all paying, and going to be paying for a long time, for a house of cards to support all of those living beyond their means (note: they still are!). It strikes me as a very left-wing thing to do.
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A more yellow tint is likely due to sulfur dioxide...a real problem with the quality of coal burned and lack of scrubbers in China.
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Quoting atmoaggie:
You do realize this govt with our taxes has been footing the hidden costs of oil & coal all along

Yep. This government has been subsidizing extra costs to keep energy costs low. So we have been paying for a product, sending taxes in and paying more for a product. Ending subsidies would make us all to actually pay upfront for consumption, but only pay for it once. No longer would you and I have to pay for the consumption of those that cannot afford what they consume. Great idea...I am all for it (I am serious about this).

Air pollutants include carbon monoxide, ozone, sulfur dioxide, nitrogen oxides, and particulates. These pollutants come primarily from the combustion of fossil fuels, principally coal-fired power plants and gasoline-powered automobiles. Nitrogen oxides can lead to the formation of ground-level ozone. Particulates are emitted from a variety of sources, primarily diesel engines. "Smog"-a hybrid word used to describe the mixture of smoke and fog that blankets some cities-is primarily composed of ozone and particulates.

I know it. We should be spending 1/10th of our AGW money on this. That way we would make some actual progress on a real problem. I am a big advocate for pollution reduction through technology. All of those gases you list could be reduced except for those generated by heat (CO and NOx). Reducing the volatile organics, like Olefins, would be a huge and attainable step.

Smog (the term) is usually used for NOx (brown haze) which has a circular reaction pattern with O3, NO, NO2, and sunlight.


Gov also supports the bill for ethanol and entitlements etc. Its all our money thats getting spent anyway you look at it. How about the mortgage and bank bailouts. Same thing.

Will carbon sequestration help us and is it worth it? Does it squelch the CO2 issue and extend out ability to have our creature comforts?
Member Since: June 12, 2005 Posts: 6 Comments: 8188
A Nice Sunny Day in Hong Kong






Beijing,China from Orbit
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Quoting Skyepony:
Ryan's handle is Stormdude77


Oh yeah. Thanx.
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Good to hear, Aussie.

Our fires in St. Tammany Parish, LA are contained, too. (seriously, they do not compare to yours. Ours only burned ~3000 acres), but they are in a parish (county) of ~300k residents and caused some problems. Schools had to close, some businesses in the smoke had to shut down, etc. No major impacts.
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You do realize this govt with our taxes has been footing the hidden costs of oil & coal all along

Yep. This government has been subsidizing extra costs to keep energy costs low. So we have been paying for a product, sending taxes in and paying more for a product. Ending subsidies would make us all to actually pay upfront for consumption, but only pay for it once. No longer would you and I have to pay for the consumption of those that cannot afford what they consume. Great idea...I am all for it (I am serious about this).

Air pollutants include carbon monoxide, ozone, sulfur dioxide, nitrogen oxides, and particulates. These pollutants come primarily from the combustion of fossil fuels, principally coal-fired power plants and gasoline-powered automobiles. Nitrogen oxides can lead to the formation of ground-level ozone. Particulates are emitted from a variety of sources, primarily diesel engines. "Smog"-a hybrid word used to describe the mixture of smoke and fog that blankets some cities-is primarily composed of ozone and particulates.

I know it. We should be spending 1/10th of our AGW money on this. That way we would make some actual progress on a real problem. I am a big advocate for pollution reduction through technology. All of those gases you list could be reduced except for those generated by heat (CO and NOx). Reducing the volatile organics, like Olefins, would be a huge and attainable step.

Smog (the term) is usually used for NOx (brown haze) which has a circular reaction pattern with O3, NO, NO2, and sunlight.
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It's over: Victorian fires contained
Article from: AAP

March 14, 2009 12:15pm

All of Victoria's bushfires have now been contained.
Emergency services said the Wilsons Promontory Cathedral fire was finally contained at 10am (AEDT) today, ending the last major bushfire that had been threatening Victoria since Black Saturday.

Australia's worst natural disaster has claimed the lives of 210 Victorians, more than 2000 homes and burnt 421,670 hectares of public and private land since starting on February 7.

Department of Sustainability and Environment (DSE) state duty officer Dennis Ward acknowledged the combined firefighting effort of the DSE and Country Fire Authority (CFA) in containing the Wilsons Promontory bushfire.

A lightning strike sparked the fire on 8 February, and it has burnt over 25,200 hectares of the national park.

"The recent rainfall and milder weather enabled firefighters to strengthen containment lines and bring the fire under control," Mr Ward said.

"Wilsons Promontory will remain closed until the end of March 2009.

"The focus is now on rehabilitation efforts to help the national park starts its recovery."

Residents within the Wilsons Promontory and other fire-affected regions are reminded that there may still be some intermittent fire activity and localised smoke behind control lines over coming days.

"Falling trees and tree limbs are also an ongoing hazard, and this danger could continue for several weeks to come."

CFA state duty officer Neil Bumpstead has also warned that the bushfire threat is not over.

"After 12 years of drought and below-average rainfall, the whole of Victoria remains tinder dry and the fire threat persists," he said.

"Until we receive widespread heavy rain, there is still the potential for severe fire days in March and April and more bushfires."
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Lake Charles Radar
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93. Skyepony (Mod)
Ryan's handle is Stormdude77
Member Since: August 10, 2005 Posts: 208 Comments: 39049
92. Skyepony (Mod)
atmoaggie~
Air Pollution Fatalities Now Exceed Traffic Fatalities by 3 to 1

The World Health Organization reports that 3 million people now die each year from the effects of air pollution. This is three times the 1 million who die each year in automobile accidents. A study published in The Lancet in 2000 concluded that air pollution in France, Austria, and Switzerland is responsible for more than 40,000 deaths annually in those three countries. About half of these deaths can be traced to air pollution from vehicle emissions.

In the United States, traffic fatalities total just over 40,000 per year, while air pollution claims 70,000 lives annually. U.S. air pollution deaths are equal to deaths from breast cancer and prostate cancer combined. This scourge of cities in industrial and developing countries alike threatens the health of billions of people.

Air pollutants include carbon monoxide, ozone, sulfur dioxide, nitrogen oxides, and particulates. These pollutants come primarily from the combustion of fossil fuels, principally coal-fired power plants and gasoline-powered automobiles. Nitrogen oxides can lead to the formation of ground-level ozone. Particulates are emitted from a variety of sources, primarily diesel engines. "Smog"-a hybrid word used to describe the mixture of smoke and fog that blankets some cities-is primarily composed of ozone and particulates.

We are about to be left behind economically cause the less than $1 a watt solar panel is about to hit the street. You do realize this govt with our taxes has been footing the hidden costs of oil & coal all along~ from health care, pollution disasters to making sure other countrys will feed us our oil..

How about what Hamish did..37 miles of beach closed, oil, fertilizer, chemicals from a boat.

That was Queenland's tourist hotspot.

Member Since: August 10, 2005 Posts: 208 Comments: 39049
Global and Northern Hemisphere Tropical Cyclone Activity [still] lowest in 30-years

Hey Vort, see post 6 for other plots that go with that.

Y'all do know that Ryan (the guy behind that work) posts here during the season a lot, right. I cannot remember his handle, though.
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89
Very Nice
Member Since: June 12, 2005 Posts: 6 Comments: 8188
ESL by LSU Link





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Quoting CycloneOz:
I thought that when the glaciers melted down, there was supposed to be a rise in the ocean.

So, I'm assuming after all these years of glacial melting that I can no longer walk along the broadwalk at Hollywood Beach, Florida.

How about NY harbor? Is the Statue of Liberty getting her feet wet yet?

Now...I have nothing against "clean" energy, but my cars run on gasoline. My home furnace burns natural gas. And my electricity comes from a coal plant.

I will not wake up tomorrow, or next week, or next year and find these circumstances to be different.

What do we need? ENERGY!
When do we need it? NOW!

Didn't you take science? Ice which is already in water, which melts in water, doesn't change the volume of the water, because the ice has the same mass... It isn't the melting of the Arctic anyone was worried about. It was the melting of ice on the land, like Greenland, because the water would then go into the ocean, adding to its volume. Ice which is already in water has the same mass when it melts and thus there is no change in sea level, although the meltwater can work to change currents like the gulf stream and is already affecting wildlife. Not will be - is. Once it gets warm enough for more ice on Antarctica to melt, we're going to see serious sea level rise. And it will happen much more quickly than people realize, and be concentrated in the temperate zones and the tropics, thanks to the miracle of physics, the greater flexibility of water when compared to ice, and a spinning earth. I don't think a great threat to humanity due to climate change is a maybe anymore. It's a will.

P.S. to Severe Hurricane: I've seen people say "It's all about the money" before, but nobody wants to explain that comment. Are you talking about money to refit factories? Money companies make by asking people to use less energy, recycle...? Do you think the government is going to scare people into giving up their bank accounts?
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Can someone give me an educated opinion on this since I have obtained absolutely nothing else over the last few blogs on this process?

I am not sure of any down side here and could use some educated opinions. Can this help ?????? Is it worth the investment?

Note: no potential misinterpretations on this post, hopefully. §



Member Since: June 12, 2005 Posts: 6 Comments: 8188
Quoting floridafisherman:
#81

but its rude of you to post " see my little rude friend is still trying to learn the dialog in a public forum thing."

2 rudes dont make a right


As stated earlier, if you don't give someone the power to bother you , they can't.

Member Since: June 12, 2005 Posts: 6 Comments: 8188
#81

but its rude of you to post " see my little rude friend is still trying to learn the dialog in a public forum thing."

2 rudes dont make a right
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Quoting mommamassie:
This is my first post on this blog. I've been reading it since I found this wonderful site. It is, at the moment, a bit annoying however, when I've attempted to ignore "Floridafisherman" the link was bad. I sincerely hope this feature is quickly restored.

I would like to thank everyone at Wunderground for this amazing site. It's been sweet to have this outstanding alternative to the weatherchannel....

God Bless America and free enterprise (and for anyone interested... Burning the American Flag is without a doubt one of the most disgusting and cowardly displays possible. If you aren't happy with your country... You're welcome to leave... )

Sabrina


I had no issues doing just that. Please try again and do not let him run you off. That is how they win and get their kicks.
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# 76...
the ignore option is working just fine. in fact, it worked the first time i put your name on it.
------
#77... you posted this...
You should spend your time worrying about yourself and not what anyone else thinks.

sounds kinda conflicting, seeing how you are obviously worring about what i am saying. as for talking 'spit', the conversation was feces and i was making a play on words. i guess that went over your head though.

as for animals deficating into our water supply, theres not much we can do about that. that is why we have beach closings all over the place, because of fecal induced e coli springing up. about the only thing we can do is wait until the tides dilute it enough to make it safe for swimming again.

#78.... critizing the president is totally legal. i voted for obama, but im not totally happy with some of the moves hes made already. as for racist, it IS FACT that some ppl didnt vote for the guy because of that exact reason, as many ppl also voted FOR him because of his race. both reasons are wrong. ppl should vote for a candidate because of their platform, not race.

#79....
i consider myself libertarian also. but when i protested the iraq war, i was lumped in with all the liberals as a non patriot and non american because i was excercizing my constitutional rights. the current conservative party (gop) is anything BUT conservative. ron paul made the most sense of all the candidates, but alas, he wasnt on the ballot here in florida.
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I'm a registered Republican...but I guess I lean more libertarian on a lot of points.

I consider myself a conservative.
But I sure don't fit your mold and your understanding of a conservative.

I protested the Iraq involvement and still do.

Things are not as black and white as you are trying to paint them.


Dang, Vort, we have a lot in common.

I refuse to register for a party, but I was all against spreading our anti-terrorism war to Iraq, although, I am fairly conservative on most subjects...like energy use (wink).

These guys know not what they are arguing against. I have no problems with resource conservation, I only have a problem with government mandates.

I see my little rude friend is still trying to learn the dialog in a public forum thing.
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78. HTV
Quoting floridafisherman:
i agree with the no flag burning. however, burning presidents in effigy is a great form of protest. it was done during the american revolution when the colonists burned effigies of king george.

i am still curious why conservatives called liberals unamerican for voicing their disapproval of the iraqi invasion. i mean, these conservatives were essentially calling these ppl unamerican even though they were exercizing their fundamental right given by the constitution. whos really the 'un-american' in that case?

Kind of like someone questioning President Obama's policies or political positions being labeled as a racist. Hmmm?
hey floridafisherman,

How many other animals on this planet send their feces to a sewer plant. All of their crap is on the ground and ends up in the waterways, so what you gonna do about that. As far as I have seen on this blog you are the only one talking spit. You should spend your time worrying about yourself and not what anyone else thinks. You cannot control anyone else's thoughts.

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This is my first post on this blog. I've been reading it since I found this wonderful site. It is, at the moment, a bit annoying however, when I've attempted to ignore "Floridafisherman" the link was bad. I sincerely hope this feature is quickly restored.

I would like to thank everyone at Wunderground for this amazing site. It's been sweet to have this outstanding alternative to the weatherchannel....

God Bless America and free enterprise (and for anyone interested... Burning the American Flag is without a doubt one of the most disgusting and cowardly displays possible. If you aren't happy with your country... You're welcome to leave... )

Sabrina
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i agree with the no flag burning. however, burning presidents in effigy is a great form of protest. it was done during the american revolution when the colonists burned effigies of king george.

i am still curious why conservatives called liberals unamerican for voicing their disapproval of the iraqi invasion. i mean, these conservatives were essentially calling these ppl unamerican even though they were exercizing their fundamental right given by the constitution. whos really the 'un-american' in that case?
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74. HTV
Quoting floridafisherman:
ok vortix, i watched part of his online show. i do have a question to ask conservatives though. he posted a listing of his principles.
heres one i found interesting.

#8. It is not un-American for me to disagree or share my personal opinion.

but yet, why didnt that principle apply to liberals who protested the iraq war? they were certainly called 'unamerican' by conservatives, and only for expressing their opinions. i guess #8 only applies now that theres a democratic majority in congress and in the white house.

sorry for the rather non weather topic. on a weather note, swfla weather has been great the last few days!
Quoting floridafisherman:
ok vortix, i watched part of his online show. i do have a question to ask conservatives though. he posted a listing of his principles.
heres one i found interesting.

#8. It is not un-American for me to disagree or share my personal opinion.

but yet, why didnt that principle apply to liberals who protested the iraq war? they were certainly called 'unamerican' by conservatives, and only for expressing their opinions. i guess #8 only applies now that theres a democratic majority in congress and in the white house.

sorry for the rather non weather topic. on a weather note, swfla weather has been great the last few days!

Disagreeing about the Iraq war is your right and privilege, but no one should have the right to burn American Flags and effigies of American Presidents and harass the mourning of fallen heroes at their funeral. PERIOD!
Southeast Texas affected by Ike square shoulders, push forward six months later
By THE ENTERPRISE
March, 12, 2009

Six months after Hurricane Ike's devastating lunge across the Texas Gulf Coast, residents of the hardest-hit areas still have plenty of recovery work ahead of them.
Link
A note from those lesser known areas.
Member Since: August 15, 2008 Posts: 10 Comments: 3665
ok vortix, i watched part of his online show. i do have a question to ask conservatives though. he posted a listing of his principles.
heres one i found interesting.

#8. It is not un-American for me to disagree or share my personal opinion.

but yet, why didnt that principle apply to liberals who protested the iraq war? they were certainly called 'unamerican' by conservatives, and only for expressing their opinions. i guess #8 only applies now that theres a democratic majority in congress and in the white house.

sorry for the rather non weather topic. on a weather note, swfla weather has been great the last few days!
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Jeff co-founded the Weather Underground in 1995 while working on his Ph.D. He flew with the NOAA Hurricane Hunters from 1986-1990.

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