Averaging together antarctic and arctic sea ice hides an important truth

By: Dr. Jeff Masters , 2:37 PM GMT on January 15, 2009

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Since my last post designating arctic sea ice loss as the top climate story of 2008, I've heard a lot comments like this one: "Jeff, you just can't seem to understand the that man-made global warming is a fable and complete hoax. In all that blathering about the falsified IPCC reports and the study of the arctic ice sheet, you somehow neglected to mention that the ice recovered not only what it lost last year, but is now larger than the previous known record measured in 1978".

Well, I can understand this point of view, given complexity of the climate change issue, and the large amount of conflicting information one sees in the media. Let's look at the facts about global sea ice. You can look at the data yourself at the excellent University of Illinois Cryosphere Today web site. Reliable sea ice records go back to 1979, when satellite measurements began. Antarctic sea ice reached its greatest extent on record during the winter of 2007. Summertime ice coverage also increased in 2007-2008 compared to 2006 levels (Figure 1). However, as one can see from Figure 1, there is high variability in antarctic sea ice from winter to summer, and antarctic sea ice can best be described as having stayed constant since 1979 (as stated in the 2007 report of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC). The IPCC did find that there had been a significant decline in arctic sea ice, in all seasons, between 1979-2006. Despite this decline, there have been three periods during the past two years when the sum of the arctic and antarctic sea ice was the same or even higher than it was at the start of the satellite era (1979). An article published January 1 on Daily Tech noted that "global sea ice levels now equal those seen 29 years ago". This was pretty close to the truth on December 31, 2008, despite the fact that arctic ice was 1 million km^2 below 1979 levels, since antarctic ice was 0.5 million km^2 above 1979 levels. Although arctic sea ice extent has steadily declined since 1979, especially in summer, this decline is not as great during the winter months. One can find periods in winter when summing together antarctic and arctic sea ice area makes it appear that arctic sea ice loss is no big deal.

However, this is the wrong way to look at the issue. We don't care much about global sea ice in winter. We care about arctic sea ice in the summer. Sharp declines in summertime arctic ice are likely to cause significant and damaging alterations to Earth's climate. Cleverly quoting irrelevant facts about global wintertime sea ice data to hide the summertime loss of arctic sea ice is a tremendous disservice. It's like hiding the potential impact of a major hurricane in a one-week forecast by saying, "the average peak wind speed for the next seven days will be 17 mph", and neglecting to mention that the wind will be calm six of those days, but 120 mph on the other day. The loss of arctic sea ice the past two summers, is, in my view, the most important human-caused climate change event yet--even more significant and dangerous than the opening of the antarctic ozone hole in the 1980s. It's great that we're not seeing loss of sea ice in Antarctica. But, both the Antarctic and the Arctic can be thought of as important internal organs in our living Earth. The fact that the Antarctic has not undergone significant warming and sea ice loss in no way diminishes the urgency with which climate scientists view the diseased state of our Arctic. Fully 88 presentations on arctic sea ice were made last month at the world's largest scientific climate change conference, the American Geophysical Union (AGU) meeting in San Francisco. None of these scientists averaged together the arctic and antarctic sea ice together to show that the overall state of Earth's cryosphere was a healthy one. There was widespread concern for the health of the Arctic among all the scientists I spoke with, and none of the speakers at the talks I attended expressed the idea that the recent melting of arctic sea ice was predominantly natural, with human-caused climate change an insignificant factor. One view (Stroeve et al., 2007) is that human-emitted greenhouse gases are responsible for 47-57% of the arctic sea ice loss since 1979. Heat-absorbing black soot from fires and pollution settling on the white ice is thought to also be a significant contributor.


Figure 1. Antarctic sea ice area as observed via satellite since 1978. The maximum area in winter has ranged between 14-16 million square kilometers, about the same amount of ocean that the Arctic ice covers in winter. However, the antarctic sea ice almost entirely melts away in summer, something the Arctic sea ice does not do (yet). Antarctica is a huge continent that rises thousands of feet above the ocean. It holds about 90% of the world's fresh water, locked up in its massive ice cap. The presence of such a titanic block of ice at the bottom of the world completely dominates the weather and climate of the region, and the year-to-year fluctuations of sea ice don't have a lot of impact on temperatures there. Image credit: University of Illinois Cryosphere Today.

What is the current state of Antarctic climate?
At the December 2008 AGU meeting, scientists gave Antarctica a mixed bill of health. Isabella Velicogna of UC Irvine reported that satellite gravitational variation measurements of Antarctica's ice cap showed significant loss of ice between 2002-2008, but that the large natural variations in melting with the seasons made it difficult to be confident of the results. A somewhat different result was reported by J. Zwally of NASA. Using data from a higher-resolution satellite-borne laser altimeter, he found that there was no major loss of Antarctica's ice sheet between 2003-2007. Regardless of which data set is correct, Antarctica is in better shape than the Arctic because Antarctica has stayed relatively cool in recent decades (Figure 2). For example, the surface temperature at the South Pole cooled 0.05° C between 1980 and 1999 (Kwok and Comiso, 2002). The majority of Antarctica has shown no statistically significant warming over the past 50 years (Turner et al., 2005), and cooling has just been dominant between 1982-2004. In the period 2004-2007, much of the Antarctic warmed (Figure 3), but it is too early to say if this is the beginning of a warming trend. Check out the January 22 issue of Nature when new results about whether or not Antarctica is warming will be published.


Figure 2. Antarctic surface temperatures as observed via AHVRR satellite measurements between 1982 and 2004. Much of Antarctica cooled during this period. Image credit: IPCC The Physical Science Basis, Figure 3.32.


Figure 3. Antarctic surface temperatures as observed via AHVRR satellite measurements between 1981 and 2007. Note that the cooling trend observed from 1982-2004 reversed, thanks to warming from 2004-2007. Image credit: NASA

Why did Antarctica cool between 1982 and 2004 if there was global warming going on?
The weather of the Antarctic is dominated by a strong band of westerly winds that blow around the pole. This circumpolar vortex extends from the surface to the stratosphere, and can attain very high wind speeds, thanks to the absence of large land masses to slow it down. This vortex tends to isolate Antarctica from the rest of the globe, keeping global warming from influencing Antarctica's weather, and allowing the surface to cool. The Antarctic Peninsula, which sticks out from Antarctica towards South America, frequently lies outside the vortex. This has allowed the peninsula to warm significantly, compared to the rest of Antarctica (Figures 2 and 3). The antarctic circumpolar vortex has strengthened in the past 25-30 years, forming an even stronger barrier than usual. Tree ring records (Jones and Widman, 2004) suggest that the circumpolar vortex has shown similar strengthening in the past, so the current cooling trend in Antarctica may be natural.

Another possibility, favored by climate modelers, is that the strengthening of the circumpolar vortex and recent cooling in Antarctica are primarily due to a combination of the recent increase in greenhouse gases and the opening of the Antarctic ozone hole. The ozone hole opened up at about the same time as the recent cooling began. Ozone absorbs UV radiation which heats the atmosphere around it, so the absence of ozone has led to cooling in the stratosphere over Antarctica. This cooling has been about 10° C in October-November since 1985 (Thompson and Solomon, 2002). This has acted to intensify the circumpolar vortex, leading to surface cooling. If the climate modelers are right, the circumpolar vortex will weaken as the ozone hole diminishes in coming decades. This will allow the Antarctic to begin warming with the rest of the globe, in a decade or two.

References and resources
Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), 2007, The Physical Science Basis.

Jones, J.M., and M. Widman, "Atmospheric science: Early peak in Antarctic oscillation index," Nature 432, 290-291 (18 November 2004) | doi:10.1038/432290b; Published online 17 November 2004.

Kwok, R., and J.C. Comiso, "Spatial patterns of variability in Antarctic surface temperature: Connections to the Southern Hemisphere Annular Mode and the Southern Oscillation", GEOPHYSICAL RESEARCH LETTERS, VOL. 29, NO. 14, 10.1029/2002GL015415, 2002.

Thompson, D.W.J., and S. Solomon, "Interpretation of Recent Southern Hemisphere Climate Change", Science 3 May 2002: Vol. 296. no. 5569, pp. 895 - 899 DOI: 10.1126/science.1069270.

Stroeve, J., M.M. Holland, W. Meier, T. Scambos, and M. Serreze, Arctic sea ice decline:Faster than forecast", GRL 34 L09501, doi:1029/2007GL029703, 2007.

Turner, J. et al., 2005, "Antarctic climate change during the last 50 years", International Journal of Climatology, Volume 25, Issue 3, pp 279-294.

Arctic sea ice

"Antarctic cooling, global warming?" RealClimate.org post, 3 December 2004.

Volunteers needed for disaster relief fund-raising
The portlight.org disaster relief charity is in the process of wrapping up its Hurricane Ike relief efforts, and is looking ahead to the future. According the new wunderground featured blog, Portlight Disaster Relief, "Our goals are to expand our network of supporters, continue to create a sense of ownership and community and create a financial reserve. Achieving these goals is critical to us being able to serve future hurricane victims in a strategic, pro-active and efficient manner." To this end, Portlight is sponsoring a fund-raising effort this March and April in 40 cities--a Spring Relief Walk. Volunteers in twenty cities have already committed to the effort, and more volunteers are needed! Check out the Portlight Disaster Relief blog for more information.

Coming Monday: Inauguration Weather. Wednesday: is the globe cooling? A report on temperatures for 2008, merely the 9th warmest year on record.

Jeff Masters

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This cold weather is cramping my sense of fashion....hard to dress like a pirate with layers of thermal insulated clothes...hard to dance and swagger the deck as well with frosty toes.... ahhh well this to shall pass

although I don't like looking like a Pasty....(people from the north)

much prefer looking like a tart!
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Sorry, had to modify my post, was not -20, hit the dash button instead of the = button, need more coffee.
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267. IKE
28.4 was my low....it's cold outside....temp is heading up now.
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Good Morning, temp in Macon, Ga is 20*F, wind chill of 10*F. Warm compared to Fargo, ND.
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Morning everyone.

Orca, your "diary" cracked me up bro, brought an early morning smile to my face, thanks.
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temp here has dropped a degree in the last hour. Sun coming up, hope it warms up some.
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263. IKE
Quoting IKE:


Same here in Defuniak Springs,FL. I'm on lake-front property with another lake across the street. It's almost always about 5 degrees warmer then forecast.

My forecast for tonight is for a low from 22 to 26. That usually means upper 20's where I live.


And upper 20's it's been....low so far.... 28.6....the sun is coming up now......
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morning all from zephyrhills FL. only down to 41 last night thanks to the clouds over head. have a great day.
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true MissNadia,,,,,, but I'd much prefer a nap in the Sun on a HOT Beach.....and wearing all these layers of thermal clothes cramps my style!!
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Hi Surfmom..good sleeping weather in SRQ.
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Whew, MissNadia -- mighty frosty --
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Aloha and Good Morning...I woke to 48 degrees here in SWFL --better then yesterday 47. Just hoping the SUN will be out. The skies were so grey and cloudy --looked like the North-- not a tropic paradise.

SWFL Cold front Surf Info.
The big chill has descending upon us, but the big swell is still eluding us. Yesterday morning we had an inconsistent, shin/knee high, glassy little leftover. Probably a long board wave out there, but that is it for today. last night the Arctic blast swept past the state dropping the temps down into the "shrivel" zone and possibly bump up the surf (waist high at best) at the best N facing beaches BBBRRRR! Gulf Temp 64

I'm not getting wet on this one
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Good Morning All- 13 degrees here in Sunny Southern Maryland. Which beats the -30 at my sister's in western Maine. Orca, thanks for the diary pages, needed a good laugh.

Stay Warm
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It's COLD in Carolina this Morning~!!
ILM is 25 with a a wind chill of 13!!!
Clear skies with a West wind at 14
High is only going to be 34!!!
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There is a new invest by Australia although it looks very rugged and if a coc is found it looks like it would be on land.
Sun, Mon , and Tuesday's snow chance increased from 30% to 40% if this continues we will have some good snow even a snow day if it lasts till Wednesday.
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252. unf97
Yeah, the temperature probly will drop to 31-32 degrees by 8.a.m., before they slowly warm up today. That high cirrus cloud canopy out of the GOM helped in keeping the temps from really falling overnight. Also, thr arctic boundary took a bit longer to pass through North FL also, which I discussed earlier. The real cold conditions will be tonight and Safurday morning. Although the center of the Arctic High will stay north of this region, plenty of cold air spilling in will give hard freeze warning criteria to us all in North FL/ South GA , especially tomorrow morning.
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251. IKE
Quoting TampaSpin:


That moisture is what im talking about combinded with the low temps tonite will make things very interesting in parts of Florida...white stuff could be very possible!


Sorry TampaSpin....no snow...air is way too dry....don't get pissed at me..just observing...

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250. IKE
Winds here are already NNE.
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249. IKE
Quoting unf97:
Good morning everyone. Although it took a bit longer than anticipated, the arctic frontal boundary has finally passed through the Jax metro area. The boundary came through after midnight, and now temps and dew points are falling off at a good rate. Just checked my current temp reading at 34 degrees at 5 a.m. North winds are blowing in at 10-20 mph. Also, a canopy of high cirrus clouds streaming northeast out of the GOM has also keep temp up some during the overnight. However, with the arctic boundary having passed through now, the temperature should drop a few degrees below freezing until around 8 a.m. Very cold day for NE FL/ SE GA area for today. Cold air advection in full effect for the next 2 days. High temps for Jax only expected to reach the mid 40s today. Min temps by Sat morning in the low 20s here in my area of North Jax. Saturday high temp forecast low 50s. A temporary moderation of temps Sunday ahead of another cold front moving into the area late in the weekend. There may be enough of a moisture return ahead of this system to produce rain on Monday into this area. Also, things could get interesting just a few hours up the road from here in the Carolinas on Monday as well. There is a possibilty of light snow in SC midlands/NC piedmont region as partial thickness values, along with a rather significant short wave moving through the base of the deep upper level trough over the Eastern ConUS, may cause that to take plave Monday. Have a good day everyone. Stay warm!


Your temperature probably won't make it a few degrees below freezing this morning....

Jacksonville, Florida (Airport)
Updated: 32 min 57 sec ago
Clear
35 °F

Clear
Windchill: 29 °F
Humidity: 42%
Dew Point: 14 °F
Wind: 7 mph from the NNW
Pressure: 30.51 in (Rising)
Visibility: 10.0 miles
UV: 0 out of 16
Clouds:
Clear -
(Above Ground Level)
Elevation: 30 ft


I'm to your west...in Defuniak Springs,FL. I've got 30.0 right now. Actually...30.2. 30.0 has been my low so far.

Not near as cold as forecasted. The high just didn't go far enough south.
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248. unf97
Good morning everyone. Although it took a bit longer than anticipated, the arctic frontal boundary has finally passed through the Jax metro area. The boundary came through after midnight, and now temps and dew points are falling off at a good rate. Just checked my current temp reading at 34 degrees at 5 a.m. North winds are blowing in at 10-20 mph. Also, a canopy of high cirrus clouds streaming northeast out of the GOM has also keep temp up some during the overnight. However, with the arctic boundary having passed through now, the temperature should drop a few degrees below freezing until around 8 a.m. Very cold day for NE FL/ SE GA area for today. Cold air advection in full effect for the next 2 days. High temps for Jax only expected to reach the mid 40s today. Min temps by Sat morning in the low 20s here in my area of North Jax. Saturday high temp forecast low 50s. A temporary moderation of temps Sunday ahead of another cold front moving into the area late in the weekend. There may be enough of a moisture return ahead of this system to produce rain on Monday into this area. Also, things could get interesting just a few hours up the road from here in the Carolinas on Monday as well. There is a possibilty of light snow in SC midlands/NC piedmont region as partial thickness values, along with a rather significant short wave moving through the base of the deep upper level trough over the Eastern ConUS, may cause that to take plave Monday. Have a good day everyone. Stay warm!
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Wow! Clayton Lake, Me (the airport) is now at -43F!! That has got to be a record for the date.
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Quoting StormMan:
Dr. Masters.

Fact is, 30 years of satellite records are insufficient to make any judgements regarding climate, period. Especially when melt ponds are counted as open ocean!

http://www.crrel.usace.army.mil/sid/perovich/DKPpdf/complexyet.pdf

And, this year when there was a 'lot of first year' ice the lack of snow cover enabled it to re-freeze faster than most believed and, presto, current ice coverage is on par as 1979! So much for 'current knowledge'.

Let's not forget la nina has come back for the 2nd year in a row when most thought it was a one year singluar event:

http://www.cdc.noaa.gov/people/klaus.wolter/MEI/

Read up on history (I'm sure you have) and you will find "astonishing" lack of ice at the artic in the past 100 years.

As I understand, the winds shifted and blew the ice into warm waters and hastened its summertime dissipation:

http://www.arctic.noaa.gov/report07/ocean.html

Not only that, but, multiple underwater volcanoes (directly under the artic circle) have been erupting since 1999:

http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=299718849952830

To cast blame on any one event (man made or not) is foolish and deceitful of someone with a PhD in science.

And, let's not forget the threat that is Chaiten or Okmok or Kasatochi or ......any of those blow big (VE7+) and it will chill even more than the lagging solar minimum is providing with decreasing solar winds and increasing GCRs.

Pretty much all we can do is enjoy the ride.



hmmm...where to begin??

Let's go to this new, already tired, argument that sea ice this year, globally, was 'on par' with 1979.

This may take a little time, but since you're so adamant in your argument, maybe you'll have the fortitude to accomplish this task...


Let's take every day of sea ice area during 1979 and get the average. Now do the same for 2008. (It seems from your post that you have some resources)

I think you'll find that 1979 averaged a LOT more ice than 2008 did.


Second, what does La Nina coming back a 2nd year have to do with the point of your argument? I simply don't see where that bit of information fits in, but, whatever...


Also, if you read through some of Dr.Masters' blogs you'll see that he has documented the unusual wind patterns in the arctic which blew ice into the North Atlantic in prior blogs. However, unusual wind patterns or not, that still doesn't explain why the arctic was upwards of 5°C above normal last summer. (Yes, temperature does matter too.)


Next, this with the volcanoes again?

Have you ever done the math to see how much magma would have to be erupted to actually warm a fraction of a percent of water in the arctic just...JUST...1°C? I think you'll be quite astonished. Besides, if these volcanoes are located "directly under the arctic circle" as you so claim then how would they melt ice during the summer even considering the wild notion that they would have warmed the surrounding water. Don't you know that sea ice is no where to be found at that latitude during the summer months (except for small strips along the east coast of Greenland and in Hudson Bay)? Most of the sea ice had already retreated north of the arctic circle by the summer. Besides, what we're talking about here is perennial ice, not seasonal ice...

If these volcanoes were even having an effect don't you think we'd see a big polynya in the winter above these supposed volcanoes?

I also take particular exception with this statement

"To cast blame on any one event (man made or not) is foolish and deceitful of someone with a PhD in science."

Had you been a regular reader of this blog, you'd know why.
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Latest from Maine


Clayton Lake, Maine
Lat: 46.62 Lon: -69.53 Elev: 1030
Last Update on Jan 16, 1:25 am EST

NA

-39°F
(-40°C)
Humidity: 65 %
Wind Speed: Calm
Barometer: 30.16" (1028.4 mb)
Dewpoint: -47°F (-44°C)
Visibility: NA
Member Since: Posts: Comments:
Dr. Masters.

Fact is, 30 years of satellite records are insufficient to make any judgements regarding climate, period. Especially when melt ponds are counted as open ocean!

http://www.crrel.usace.army.mil/sid/perovich/DKPpdf/complexyet.pdf

And, this year when there was a 'lot of first year' ice the lack of snow cover enabled it to re-freeze faster than most believed and, presto, current ice coverage is on par as 1979! So much for 'current knowledge'.

Let's not forget la nina has come back for the 2nd year in a row when most thought it was a one year singluar event:

http://www.cdc.noaa.gov/people/klaus.wolter/MEI/

Read up on history (I'm sure you have) and you will find "astonishing" lack of ice at the artic in the past 100 years.

As I understand, the winds shifted and blew the ice into warm waters and hastened its summertime dissipation:

http://www.arctic.noaa.gov/report07/ocean.html

Not only that, but, multiple underwater volcanoes (directly under the artic circle) have been erupting since 1999:

http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=299718849952830

To cast blame on any one event (man made or not) is foolish and deceitful of someone with a PhD in science.

And, let's not forget the threat that is Chaiten or Okmok or Kasatochi or ......any of those blow big (VE7+) and it will chill even more than the lagging solar minimum is providing with decreasing solar winds and increasing GCRs.

Pretty much all we can do is enjoy the ride.
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Quoting searcher14:
Dear Jeff - Your blog article on arctic sea ice is misleading - this is indeed the biggest climate story of 2008 – but you have it exactly backwards --

Your headline should be:
Sea Ice Ends Year at Same Level as 1979
www.dailytech.com/Article.aspx?newsid=13834
Thanks to a rapid rebound in recent months, global sea ice levels now equal those seen 29 years ago, when the year 1979 also drew to a close. Ice levels had been tracking lower throughout much of 2008, but rapidly recovered in the last quarter. In fact, the rate of increase from September onward is the fastest rate of change on record, either upwards or downwards.“


While the surface may be the same, all the old ice that is hundreds of years old has melted and i guarantee you that most of the new stuff will melt again.
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This is interesting...
Skagway, AK 43F
Ocala, FL 33F

Not often that this happens...
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Good evening. Report from the western suburbs of Chicago. Currently -15F, windchill is
-37F. The schools were closed today in the suburbs. Tonight is forecasted to be even colder.
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very funny stuff orca thats about how i feel right now except i havent burn down the building yet
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Quoting KEEPEROFTHEGATE:
enjoy that happy dance orca iam ordering you up some cold and 3 feet of snow febuary is coming and iam sure at least 1 maybe two more cold spells along with it


Go and read the link on this previous post :)
229. Orcasystems 3:32 AM GMT on January 16, 2009
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were not frozen just chillin
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enjoy that happy dance orca iam ordering you up some cold and 3 feet of snow febuary is coming and iam sure at least 1 maybe two more cold spells along with it
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Happy Dance Happy Dance :)

Centre of the Universe is frozen :)

Friday
A mix of sun and cloud. Wind west 20 km/h (12 mph) increasing to 40 km/h (25 mph) gusting to 60 km/h (37 mph) in the morning. High -12C(10F). Wind chill -27. Friday night cloudy periods. Wind west 30 km/h. Low -18C(0F). Wind chill -29.

We can now say that H*ll (Toronto, home of the KOG) has frozen over :)

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"I have a wager to post here. I bet that in the next 7 days our instruments and statistics are going to notice that total Arctic ice coverage is below the positive PDO norm (It will simply say ice extent anomaly, as if we have been measuring it for 1000 years) or, at the very least, be close to falling below that average level for the date."

First, I'm certainly no expert here, but I thought that the PDO index is negative right now. Why would we be comparing the Arctic ice extent a week from now to the "norm" for that date in a positive PDO? Second, what is the "norm" Arctic ice extent during a positive PDO on January 22 and where can I find this information?


"Nowhere did I say, nor did mean, we had a positive sea ice anomaly."

Didn't say you did. What I said was that making a bet that the anomaly would be negative a week from now when it has already been negative for years seems pretty safe. Again, why would anyone think that it would turn positive in the next seven days?


"Define: anomaly (from wiktionary) A deviation from a rule or from what is regarded as normal.
Question: What if the definition of "what is regarded as normal" is skewed? An anomaly is shown when there isn't one. An anomaly is possibly shown of the wrong sign. Not saying this is true, but certainly possible."


This seems like a spurious argument to me. Every time that I've seen a plot of ice extent anomalies, it's been clearly defined as relative to the 1979-2000 mean. Words and phrases are frequently used in the realm of science with different meanings than you'll find in Merriam-Webster. You have to pay attention to how they are defined in a particular context. Certainly no reasonable person with a scientific background would interpret this data as being presented as representative of conditions over thousands of years.
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AOI 15.5N/52.3W

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Quoting Orcasystems:
Here is a link to comment 723 in word format


Thanks! Much appreciated
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Quoting sullivanweather:
Update from Maine...

Clayton Lake, Maine
Lat: 46.62 Lon: -69.53 Elev: 1030
Last Update on Jan 15, 10:25 pm EST

NA

-37°F

(-38°C)
Humidity: 65 %
Wind Speed: Calm
Barometer: 30.16" (1027.8 mb)
Dewpoint: -44°F (-42°C)
Visibility: NA


Brrrr your weather sucks
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Update from Maine...

Clayton Lake, Maine
Lat: 46.62 Lon: -69.53 Elev: 1030
Last Update on Jan 15, 10:25 pm EST

NA

-37°F

(-38°C)
Humidity: 65 %
Wind Speed: Calm
Barometer: 30.16" (1027.8 mb)
Dewpoint: -44°F (-42°C)
Visibility: NA
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Here is a link to comment 723 in word format
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Quoting KEHCharleston:


I read it earlier today, and thought I would split my side laughing so hard.

Do you mind if I copy it and send it to my sister?



I put it into a word document.. do you want it?
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Quoting Orcasystems:


Go read post 723 in my blog.. it will give you an idea what your in for :)


I read it earlier today, and thought I would split my side laughing so hard.

Do you mind if I copy it and send it to my sister?

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Quoting KEHCharleston:
Evening all

Pottery, I hope you make it to Charleston someday.

Orca, KOTG - close the door, already.

It's about 45 degrees and dropping. Do not expect to see it up to 45 degrees again until Sunday.

Press, did happen to look out at the sky about 8:30pm? Looked like a satellite - I have noticed it several times when I returned to from closing the shop. Towards the west - and just a bit to the south.





Go read post 723 in my blog.. it will give you an idea what your in for :)
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c ya pot....I'm crashing, too...gettin' old....
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Sounds Fantastic, KEH.
Sounds very tempting.........

Good Night all.
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KEH....she'd be flattered.....we'll set up a date....
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That would be great. Would love to have that.

I'm gone . Its been good.
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Quoting presslord:
KEH....I'm looking right now at a charcoal sketch that was drawn by my Grandmother's sister in 1909...it's of St. Michael's from your piazza...would love to show it to you sometime.....

I would love to see it. If your daughter is so inclined, I would love to read her paper as well.

Pottery, the building where I live is a combination of buildings, the oldest part being circa 1800.
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that would be my guess, too, pottery....will get you the exact title of the satellite book next time I'm over at the boat....which ain't gonna be in the next few days....bbbbbrrrrrrrrr.....
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Did not know you could do that, Press. I will have to check it out .
There is a Satellite that goes overhead at about 7:00pm. South to North.
During its transit, it makes 1 or 2 incredible "flares". Slowly, gradually intensifies then fades slowly to norm.
I have always wondered if it is Solar Panel reflection or something.
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Jeff co-founded the Weather Underground in 1995 while working on his Ph.D. He flew with the NOAA Hurricane Hunters from 1986-1990.

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